June 19th 2013 1:54 pm PT

Your Feedback Matters – Update on Xbox One

Don Mattrick, President of the Interactive Entertainment Business at Microsoft, has made a blog post with an update on Xbox One.

Here is an excerpt from his post:

…today I am announcing the following changes to Xbox One and how you can play, share, lend, and resell your games exactly as you do today on Xbox 360. Here is what that means:

· An internet connection will not be required to play offline Xbox One games – After a one-time system set-up with a new Xbox One, you can play any disc based game without ever connecting online again. There is no 24 hour connection requirement and you can take your Xbox One anywhere you want and play your games, just like on Xbox 360.

· Trade-in, lend, resell, gift, and rent disc based games just like you do today – There will be no limitations to using and sharing games, it will work just as it does today on Xbox 360.

I encourage you to read the entire post for additional details and how Xbox One games will be playable on any Xbox One console — there will be no regional restrictions.

Thank you for your continued support of Xbox.

Update: Here is the full text of the post:

 

Last week at E3, the excitement, creativity and future of our industry was on display for a global audience.
For us, the future comes in the form of Xbox One, a system designed to be the best place to play games this year and for many years to come. As is our heritage with Xbox, we designed a system that could take full advantage of advances in technology in order to deliver a breakthrough in game play and entertainment. We imagined a new set of benefits such as easier roaming, family sharing, and new ways to try and buy games. We believe in the benefits of a connected, digital future. 
Since unveiling our plans for Xbox One, my team and I have heard directly from many of you, read your comments and listened to your feedback. I would like to take the opportunity today to thank you for your assistance in helping us to reshape the future of Xbox One. 
You told us how much you loved the flexibility you have today with games delivered on disc. The ability to lend, share, and resell these games at your discretion is of incredible importance to you. Also important to you is the freedom to play offline, for any length of time, anywhere in the world.
So, today I am announcing the following changes to Xbox One and how you can play, share, lend, and resell your games exactly as you do today on Xbox 360. Here is what that means:

  • An internet connection will not be required to play offline Xbox One games – After a one-time system set-up with a new Xbox One, you can play any disc based game without ever connecting online again. There is no 24 hour connection requirement and you can take your Xbox One anywhere you want and play your games, just like on Xbox 360.
  • Trade-in, lend, resell, gift, and rent disc based games just like you do today – There will be no limitations to using and sharing games, it will work just as it does today on Xbox 360.

In addition to buying a disc from a retailer, you can also download games from Xbox Live on day of release. If you choose to download your games, you will be able to play them offline just like you do today. Xbox One games will be playable on any Xbox One console — there will be no regional restrictions.

These changes will impact some of the scenarios we previously announced for Xbox One. The sharing of games will work as it does today, you will simply share the disc. Downloaded titles cannot be shared or resold. Also, similar to today, playing disc based games will require that the disc be in the tray.

We appreciate your passion, support and willingness to challenge the assumptions of digital licensing and connectivity. While we believe that the majority of people will play games online and access the cloud for both games and entertainment, we will give consumers the choice of both physical and digital content. We have listened and we have heard loud and clear from your feedback that you want the best of both worlds.

Thank you again for your candid feedback. Our team remains committed to listening, taking feedback and delivering a great product for you later this year.

# # #

Xbox One By Larry Hryb, Xbox LIVE's Major Nelson

  • rjmlive

    TL;DR – EXPLAIN THINGS!

    Bundling Kinect 2.0 is the right move. Thank you Microsoft for taking the initiative to move the console to the future.

    If you do any more adjustments to the platform regarding DRM, sharing, cloud anything, used games etc.. make SURE you put up a diagram, a chart, a complete picture so that it is CLEAR what you are offering! You lost a lot of fickle people purely based on your delivery, not because they have a rational reason for leaving. They got confused and scared and ran to the familiar, not that it was necessarily better.

    The problem is now you’ve teased the promise of a future direction for console gaming.. and that’s the model I wanted.

    • Xboner2013

      “Thank you Microsoft for taking the initiative to move the console to the future.”

      What did they offered?

      “You lost a lot of fickle people purely based on your delivery, not because they have a rational reason for leaving. They got confused and scared and ran to the familiar, not that it was necessarily better.”

      Who got confused, Microsoft got confused, they thought they could lie and BS they’re way out of their own mess, then that got in a further mess.

      • Shane Nokes

        They didn’t lie or BS about anything.

        They provided information, but not in a clear enough manner evidently.

        The odd thing is that I understood it all as it was being given out…but I was actually watching to interviews, and reading Xbox Wire as opposed to reading media sites that kept misquoting and misinterpreting things that were said.

        • Bibo Bird

          Damn right. I think they should have stressed WHY they were going to implement the whole DRM stuff. It just seemed to most ppl like they would not get anything back. Unfortunately MS might have assumed Prices for Games were going to decrease in the Long run, but they couldnt Promise, because it is not their decision.

          • Xboner2013

            Tell you what, have Microsoft put up their supposed Family Share plan, with no restrictions shown on the page…. were I buy a game, place it in a library at no cost and 10 people can use those games completely and fully without further fee and restrictions, and I can switch out the 10 people every 30 days, and so and so on. I will buy a freaking stupid Xbone and the stupid Kinect. But if they don’t do it, then MS buys everyone on this board a PS4 with 10 games and 5 years of PSN+.

            How about put up or shutup for them. Let’s see this family share plan with no restrictions.

          • Shane Nokes

            Just because you misread things doesn’t make it a lie. The plan has now been shelved, possibly indefinitely.

            Also they don’t need to take your bet…it just rewards bad behavior.

            Then again with the name you’re using on here I’m not surprised you have a bad attitude.

  • Shane Nokes

    Cloud computing is scalable. So what he said is true.

    Phil never said that customers would have to pay full price for transfers. I don’t know where you are getting that from.

    What Major was pointing out to AJ is that it wouldn’t be easily possible for work to be done to change the DRM model and still allow the new features. That wasn’t a lie, and it’s why they had to revert to the 360 model.

    The shared library did work as described. I worked on it until April. The only one suggesting otherwise was a document that has now been debunked.

    Before calling someone a liar do your basic research, otherwise you’re the one lying when you spread bad information.

    Geez it took a lot of attempts to get this one to post as it kept failing…bleh.

    • Xboner2013

      What MS was saying about cloud computing is hogwash snakeoil pitch, what does “scalable” have to do with anything?

      Phil actually said the truth, that your friend coulld come over install his games, then when he left you would have to buy it.

      “What Major was pointing out to AJ is that it wouldn’t be easily possible for work to be done to change the DRM model and still allow the new features.”

      Hogwash PR talk. He was down right rude and for a reason, he had nothing.

      “The shared library did work as described. I worked on it until April. The only one suggesting otherwise was a document that has now been debunked.”

      More pitches, who said it wouldn’t work? This is more deception… of course it “could” work but nobody…. nobody in their right mind was going to do that without fee.

      If I am wrong than MS will have the feature ready to go in November as they already advertised… and nothing has debunked.

      Do some basic research before you tell someone he is wrong… anybody including you that supports this nonsense are included in the sham.

      • Shane Nokes

        1. The term scalable means that you have an indefinite amount of power that can be scaled up or down to match demand. That’s what they were referring to with that statement. The only limit is the amount of physical servers and the processors driving them. You need more power you just add more. It’s fully scalable. Just because you don’t understand the context doesn’t make it a lie.

        2. That is true. If your friend comes over and installs a game, and then leaves (taking the game with him) you do have to buy it at full price. That has nothing to do with a transfer of ownership. You specifically said transfer. Phil wasn’t talking about transfers, but about them buying the game. If you GIVE the game to your friend there is not and never was a fee. You’re the one who mixed up two completely separate things.

        3. He wasn’t rude. AJ was rude by continually pulling the mic away while Major Nelson was in the middle of an answer. Larry wanted to be able to make his point without the mic being pulled away. There was 0 lie involved.

        4. Who said there wasn’t a fee? The fee was the LIVE Gold membership. It was always known that it was a Gold only feature.

        Do some basic research and figure out who you are talking to before making an idiot of yourself.

        • Xboner2013

          1. Irrelevant….. .so they have a cluster of servers which can X amount virtual servers on the…. so? Game calculations, in general are not going to be unloaded off on a distributed model, sorry that will not happen.

          2. Well, proof is in the pudding, they can just put the family plan up and we are done.

          3. He acted like it was huge tasks and acted out of line.

          4. Not on the license page it doesn’t say that.

          Do some research? Do you not work for Microsoft anymore?

          • Shane Nokes

            1. Sorry, but you’re now changing the argument. That invalidates what you’re saying automatically.

            2. The family plan had nothing to do with this scenario…so you’re changing the argument here…wait a minute I’m noticing a pattern here.

            3. Huh…doing it again…yup someone can’t stand losing, and it’s not me. ;)
            4. It was already explained that all features outside of single-player gaming, DVD/Blu-Ray Playback, Xbox Video, Xbox Music, and TV were going to require Gold. I can’t help if you can’t keep up. ;)

            What does you needing to do research have to do with me?

            Hint…it doesn’t. :P

            BTW dinner is smelling delicious…you should have some.

          • Kabwall

            I am curious, ” Game calculations, in general are not going to be unloaded off on a distributed model, sorry that will not happen.” Why? It seems to be a very large generalisation without technical substance.

            Further you propose through a majority of your comments, to purchase other competitive brands, one of which that is heavily invested in the “cloud” aspects of gaming, yet you deny Microsoft can achieve this.

            You noted the family sharing plan earlier, and choose to comment, why don’t they just put up what amounts to an unrestricted model, I am also curious, you don’t think there would be a backlash from developers beyond any scope we have seen so far? Even if Microsoft massively subsidised the developers for virtually unlimited free sharing, as described by you, there would be no backlash from the competition, who would at the very least describe the model as anti-competitive at the very least?

            You claim the Kinect is stupid, but fail to see it as an extension of the input devices we currently use, a core component, as opposed to a peripheral, and used for a far greater demographic of just games. You also fail to apply logic to your comments as to why it would inevitably fail, where you name Ryse as game that dropped that features Kinect, and use that as conclusive evidence that is will never be used for games features, however, there are several game genres that would benefit from the Kinect. Perhaps some examples, since you asked, real time strategy games, commanding and ordering forces and indivual game components via voice and motion control, AI FPS team based games, directing and ordering AI characters to perform certain actions, convergence of the multiple input methods allowing immediate, simultaneous, and fluid response to game situations.

            Would you feel more comfortable if it was inbuilt to the casing?

            In fact there seems to be a large buy in according to Amazon’s wish list and best selling divisions for the PS Eye.

            I am just interested in the “can’t work, won’t work” theories, and why.

  • Ryan

    The real issues are left on the table, these companies need to quit hiding behind the media and the DRM headlines to come clean about these issues before launch! If you want to push digital distribution then support it! Personally I have over 500gb of digital content that I cannot have sitting on my 360 to play anytime I want and then it’s worthless when the Xbox One launches because there isn’t enough storage on the current platform and MS isn’t going to support it on the Xbox One. All this makes me timid about buying and supporting digital in the future!

    • Shane Nokes

      They also aren’t supporting your discs on the Xbox One either…so does that also make you timid about buying and supporting discs in the future?

      Also what makes that 360 content worthless? You still have access to it…your 360 isn’t going anywhere and neither is your access to that content.

      • PSN_IS_GARBAGE

        The 360 could bite the dust at any given moment and that is what would make it worthless. This is also another reason why B/C is so important because it acts as another backup of our game collection if anything.

        • Shane Nokes

          That was already known at the time of purchase. Digital content has always been a risk. This didn’t just change or come to light because of the Xbox One. :)

          • PSN_IS_GARBAGE

            Thats true..

          • Ryan

            Yes, but most people assumed there would be an answer to the storage or support going further!

          • Shane Nokes

            For the 360? They’ve already said that the support isn’t going anywhere. They just released a new version of the 360 less than 2 weeks ago.

            The storage story is as it has always been. It’s not ideal for digital purchases…but that’s why I’ve always preferred having the disc available.

          • Ryan

            The new 360 should have had a replaceable hd in it for one and all the people that download more than buy discs are suppost to pay for that decision even more?

          • Shane Nokes

            It does, just like the previous 360’s.

            The Xbox One is the one that has a non-replaceable hard drive…but then again it can also support large hard drives via the USB 3.0 port.

      • Ryan

        Hard drive space! People that do have the means to buy a ton should not get nerfed for supporting the platform. I would like to have all 187 god/arcade titles sitting there ready for me to choose which to play, not choosing which are the most important to delete so I can download one that I want to play!

        • Shane Nokes

          That’s a problem far beyond the console industry.

          Heck I have to pick and choose what I want to keep and get rid of on my local machine all the time…and I have 8TB of hard drive space.

    • PSN_IS_GARBAGE

      I agree, basically our digital 360 games (XBLA, GOD, INDY, and DLC) are only going to last till the EOL of the console hardware itself. Not to mention everyone should be aware to make sure that their current 360’s were the first console they downloaded the content to. If it isn’t everyone needs to be aware to use that license transfer tool sometime before they kill the 360 servers whenever that will be. It this isn’t done by the time the servers are gone, you can’t use the tool at all anymore since you literally have to redownload the game licenses again. If this isn’t done by then, you will lose those games forever and they will become trials and you won’t have access to them offline.

      What alot of people fail to realize here is something else that further confounds the problem.. OUR GAME TITLE UPDATES and how they are stored to a temporary cache instead of being stored to our harddrives like all apps do now. Without a working title update on the console any gamesaves created post updates will no longer work and you will be forced to not only start over because you cant use your saves but you will be playing an unpatched game as well.

      I really wish Major Nelson could answer this question for me on how game title updates are going to be handled on the One. It is quite clear MS didn’t think this through because this is very important to those of us collectors who don’t want to see their investment thrown down the drain when we can’t access our games 10 years from now because either we don’t have the license or don’t have the update to access our current game saves.

    • Ryan

      In the gaming industry it’s normal to have little to no support, most people understand that going in and it makes sense! Aside the digital content I personally have over 300 disc Xbox 360 games and I’m fine keeping them and using them on a 360. I will have to say that your content is worthless if you have no storage to put it. Example, if MS said that in December of 2014 all servers will be taken down and they will not release a drive big enough to store everything, what then? It’s an issue, point blank! It’s like the redundant super slim, why put out another sku with the same hd, why not put out a sku that can internalize a replaceable 3.5″ sata drive? Anyone with digital content should have the ability to download it all, system transfer it and it be secure locally.

  • NYC Ninja

    Many security experts and media reports claim Windows contains a National Security Agency key. You can find these reports by searching for “NSA key Windows”. I’m not a terrorist, pirate or any other kind of criminal. I just don’t want Microsoft or the government to have an internet connected camera and microphone in my bedroom. Software settings are not a reliable way to disable the camera and microphone because all software has bugs and can be hacked. I’m very happy Don Mattrick decided to get rid of the requirement for an internet check-in every 24 hours. What still concerns me is that Microsoft is apparently clueless enough to have ever thought this was a good idea.

    • Shane Nokes

      No, no it doesn’t. It’s not security experts reporting that either, and the only media reporting that are the conspiracy websites, or legit sites that are commenting on the conspiracy sites.

      What concerns me are people who believe everything they read and then pretend that how they game is of concern to the government.

      • StudioMultimédia Gon’Interacti

        so many haters against a so easy to understand fact. kinect is not a treat lol.

        if i was a freak, I would mind more about the hundreds of camera that film me from my house to my job (security cam, bus, metro, etc.)

      • Dylan

        Funny. I remember when you were denying PRISM existed.

        Then 2 days later, Microsoft released the amount of information they were giving the NSA

        • Shane Nokes

          I didn’t deny that PRISM existed. I said that I was one the team that would have been supplying the Xbox data if Microsoft were just handing over data as part of PRISM.

          What was released 2 days later was information that was requested through legal warrants and weren’t related to PRISM.

          If you’re going to harp on things at least get the details right man. Details are important when it comes to accusations.

          • Dylan

            Actually it was related to PRISM, as it was information given to the NSA.

            You did deny PRISM. I remember explicitly you saying “Even the original article was detracted…”

          • Shane Nokes

            Huh…nice attempt at a quote there.

            What I said was that the Washington Post had to retract (not detract) the article that named Microsoft and other corporations in a scandal involving allowing the NSA direct access to their servers and/or volunteering information as part of a program called PRISM.

            I never said PRISM doesn’t exist. I said that WP had to retract the statements regarding the NSA having direct server access or the companies volunteering information.

            Those statements were bogus and were proven to be bogus when Microsoft fully disclosed the information that was given to law enforcement…and all of it was obtained by legal warrants.

            Nothing was volunteered and there are no secret backdoors for the NSA.

            You should really stop while you’re behind though. Just like Xboner2013 several folks are finding you amusing.

    • Sween

      People will do anything to moan about Microsoft. The Kinect isn’t watching you. Every day majority of people go round with mobile phones with cameras,videos. Are they watching those too? Or is it Sony fan boys ?

  • Sween

    The Kinect isn’t watching you. Everyday you use a mobile phone with camera , video , text and calls. Are they watching that too? Think this we are watching you is going way over the top.

    • Crypt0117

      So true. Is my laptop eye balling me right now? Paranoid.

    • http://www.youtube.com/love4musicuk Jason

      Well said.

  • Brady Nickell

    I have another question. Have they said how long you can record gameplay?

    • StudioMultimédia Gon’Interacti

      not related at all, but it will obviously record on either HD or cloud account so you can expect to have many hours of recording.

  • peba12

    I think you talk over the Kinect box, so no micro.

    • Illusionist

      Damn…

      • Shane Nokes

        Yeah no headset this time around. There is one being made, but it’s not going to be in the box this time around.

        • Illusionist

          What a stupid thing…

        • StudioMultimédia Gon’Interacti

          is that confirm ? i was in the impression that it was coming with it… but anyway, if you own a game, there is a high chance you already own a mic… so it will work.

          • Shane Nokes

            Yup, there is no headset in the box.

            Also the headsets from the Xbox 360 era are not going to work, at least not without a way to put an adapter on them. They changed the mic port on the new controllers.

          • Illusionist

            I hope that Microsoft confirms the presence of the headset…

          • StudioMultimédia Gon’Interacti

            if they do, people will complain that without it, they could sell the xbox for 400$…

  • Crypt0117

    MS you should have stuck to your guns. As you can see the whiners won’t be satisfied until you give them Xbox 540. I was excited for next gen with the Xbox One, now that’s it has been gimped by the whiners, I’m not sure I want one now.

    • Illusionist

      Don’t buy an Xbox One…problem solved!

      But now Major Nelson, tell me why you have removed the basic headset from the Xbox!

      isn’t a stupid thing ? Now my mother and all my family can hear the other people blaspheme from the tv when i kill them!

  • http://soundcloud.com/ViRUSfromMARS Jaffa Cake King

    http://www videogamer com/news/ps4_is_amazon_uks_fourth_best-selling_gaming_product_of_2013_xbox_one_70th.html

    Oh dear, Amazon UK’s best selling gaming products of 2013.

    PS4 – Number 4
    Xbox One – Number 70

    And that is after the DRM reversal.

    • Illusionist

      Are you paid from Sony ?

      • Shane Nokes

        He keeps denying it…but all he does is say he would buy it if it didn’t have Kinect, and doesn’t really post anything positive.

        He’s not a mean guy or anything…but all the negativity is a drag.

        • http://soundcloud.com/ViRUSfromMARS Jaffa Cake King

          I like how you talk about me as if I’m not here Shane.

          I’m quite shocked at the disparity of those figures actually. Plus i like the controller, that is positive.

          • Shane Nokes

            I was replying to someone else. That rule of British etiquette only applies to real-time communications such as voice, video, or in-person.

            Even I know that. Talking about someone in the third-person to another person even on a forum or message board or social media is perfectly acceptable etiquette.

            BTW I’m not shocked. Amazon UK is only selling one version of the PS4, but 2 versions of the Xbox One. So the sales figures are being split which affects the rankings for both. We also don’t know the actual numbers in play so it could be a matter of literally 1 or 2 sales between each rank on that board.

            I’m not saying that’s the case. I’m saying we don’t have a way to show what those numbers mean in terms of units sold.

          • http://soundcloud.com/ViRUSfromMARS Jaffa Cake King

            In your mind it is. I don’t find it acceptable.

          • Shane Nokes

            Not in my mind…by the actual rules of social etiquette. I have no way at any given moment of knowing if you are or are not viewing the posts.

            You could post something and then leave. Now if I was addressing you in the third person while speaking to you that would be an entirely different matter.

            I however was not addressing you, but mentioning you to someone else.

          • http://soundcloud.com/ViRUSfromMARS Jaffa Cake King

            Calm down Mr i’m only winding you up.

          • Shane Nokes

            :P

          • Shane Nokes

            BTW. I also apply the same logic to Amazon US. Even though the Xbox One Day One is topping the list at #1 there are a ton of PS4 bundles that are high up in the list. So that is very likely why the PS4 isn’t at #1 because each bundle is counted separately.

          • Illusionist

            Me too…wrong steps from Microsoft.

            If they want bring back some users, they need to announce something..

        • slider2nl

          the console is black thats positive

          • Xboner2013

            The ignore the negative crowd has always baffled me. Like it has anything to do with being negative or positive. Like the freaking device is going to be someone want through use of magic.

          • Shane Nokes

            Simple…don’t want it…then don’t buy it…and go post on boards talking about things you do want.

            Problem solved. :)

          • http://soundcloud.com/ViRUSfromMARS Jaffa Cake King

            I am posting on a board where i want something. I want an Xbox One without a Kinect.

          • Shane Nokes

            That’s not being offered though and that’s what we keep trying to tell you. They are betting very heavily on Kinect and have tied it in very deeply to the system for functionality.

            It’s an all in bet…and some folks keep trying to nicely explain that this console isn’t for you. We’ve tried to explain that you can just turn it off, but for some reason you can’t accept that.

            You go beyond the bounds of being rational in your quest.

          • http://soundcloud.com/ViRUSfromMARS Jaffa Cake King

            No i can’t accept that if it’s so integral to the functioning of the console then why give me the option to turn it off? Plus if i can turn it off then why can’t i disconnect it?

            I find it a little bit bizarre.

          • Shane Nokes

            It’s not bizarre at all. It has to do with development. They want Kinect to be used a lot more in gaming and in other environments. Part of why things were so poor with Kinect in this generation is that the functionality came in near the end of this generation, was an add-on, and because developers could not count on someone owning a Kinect.

            By making it part of the actual console itself developers can now safely invest in making those experiences better since they know that every single Xbox One will have it.

            Think of it in terms of the good old Nintendo 64. They had that expansion pak port for it…but games couldn’t count on that additional memory being there so they had to write games that wouldn’t use it, but would do extra things if it were in place.

            The problem is that sometimes this went horribly wrong…like Star Wars: Rogue Squadron. The quality was increased with the expansion pak, but the performance went into the crapper.

            It’s always best to include the things you want the console to use from Day One, rather than trying to tack it on later.

            Make a bit more sense now?

          • Xboner2013

            “because developers could not count on someone owning a Kinect.”

            LOL
            Developers dropped development because of real world physics issues, a camera is horrible input device (end of story)… over 24 million of those stupid devices were sold.

          • Shane Nokes

            Real world physics? Do you even know what physics is or do you just randomly use words?

            I’m starting to wonder (not seriously) whether or not there’s actually a person on the other side of this Xboner2013 alias or a team of monkeys trying to write Shakespeare.

          • Xboner2013

            Oh nothing to add… .yet you can’t show me one example of this device working that isn’t a dance, game, some kind of exercise game, kids game or isn’t just lame as H3ll…..

            Epic games gave it a shot and dropped the stupid thing for obvious reason… the kb&m or a controller is way faster, way more accurate and connects you to the virtual world.

            My proof… all the stupid Kinect games that already exist.

          • Shane Nokes

            I did add something. I asked if you even understand what you mean when you say the word physics.

            You didn’t respond to that at all…which tells me you don’t even have the slightest clue what you’re talking about.

            I’m guessing you’re probably still in school right and haven’t reached that chapter…or you did and your parents weren’t there to help you learn.

          • Xboner2013

            My 4 year old niece even understand… and you don’t…. hahah…

            Yeah, you are so smart, you can’t show me an example can you? NOPE.

          • Shane Nokes

            Show you an example of your answer to a question I asked you?

            I asked you if you understand…since you’re the one making the original statement the burden of proof is on you.

            I don’t expect you to actually have a coherent answer though…but it is funny to watch you deflect. We are loving watching you dance to my tune. ;)

          • Xboner2013

            Just one example, you can’t do it can you… dylan asked you…. just show us one example how this great device is capable of.

          • Shane Nokes

            You were talking about physics…dylan and I are discussing something else.

            Keep up…or is that homeschooling not working out?

          • Xboner2013

            Yeah… keep the cutdowns coming… only real men do that.

            So, about this Ryse thing, why was that dropped? Please show me these cool games that use the Kinect.

          • Dylan

            Then why is Ryse not the revolutionary Kinect game they were hyping it up to be.

            It was being developed under the promise “The full AAA experience that unlocks the potential of the Kinect”

            Everyone with an Xbox One will have a Kinect.
            Yet Ryse is mainly used with a controller.

            Why?
            Because Kinect is extremely limited as a gaming device.
            There will never be a full AAA title that uses only Kinect.

          • Xboner2013

            Yup, they gave up on it for obvious reasons.

            You never run the same gag twice in around… Nintendo did and lost….good luck MS.

          • Shane Nokes

            There are some games where Kinect makes sense and some where a controller makes sense, and some where a combination makes sense.

            There’s nothing wrong with developing for all possible scenarios.

            Why limit what a developer can do with a title?

            Everyone here keeps talking about their choices being limited…your gaming choices are more limited when you have less input options…not more.

          • Dylan

            You didn’t answer my rebuttal to your statement,

            “Part of why things were so poor with Kinect in this generation is that the functionality came in near the end of this generation, was an add-on, and because developers could not count on someone owning a Kinect.”

            Then tell me, why is Ryse, the game developed to be the AAA kinect game, almost completely drop it as in integral device?

            Kinect 2 is looking to be the same as last gen. Used in AAA games in little inconsequential ways, and in really bad full games.

          • Xboner2013

            *popcorn ready

          • Shane Nokes

            I did actually. There are some cases where it make sense to use it and some where it doesn’t.

            Removing it as a part of the core system though limits developer choice, which limits the gamer.

            I didn’t work on Ryse so I don’t know their exact logic behind it. Having seen Ryse it looks like Kinect just wasn’t a good fit for that particular game.

            Also realize that this console isn’t even out yet…and usually games right at the beginning of any generation do not utilize everything in the best way.

            That’s why things usually get better as time goes on.

            Kinect didn’t have this chance last gen as it was added on later in the life of a system that wasn’t originally designed to support it…and on top of that wasn’t released as originally intended. The Kinect was supposed to be more powerful, but got some specs cut toward the end to reduce costs.

            This isn’t the case this time around.

          • Xboner2013

            It didn’t work because it won’t freaking work…

            Excuse excuse excuse

            Dylan, you just don’t understand… you see I can’t answer the question so I will just dodge it… I come from the MS school of PR dodging questions – Nokes

          • Shane Nokes

            You can’t even explain what you mean by physics. ;)

            I got you to admit you were a troll though…which was my endgame all along…so my work here is done.

            Goodnight ladies and gentleman…be sure to tip your waiters. ;)

          • Dylan

            If a game that was built from the start as a Kinect AAA game, ended up being “not a good fit for that particular game”,

            What game is?

            And where is it? Because they haven’t shown a single AAA game warranting the price tag that Kinect brings.

            It does some neat gimmicks here and there, but it does nothing that revolutionizes the GAMES industry, which was the ENTIRE point.

            The ONLY game that could have changed things was “Milo”, and Microsoft cancelled that one!

            You’re telling us to wait? How long has the Kinect been out, 3 years? And dev’s had known for the past year that it was going to be integral to Xbox One.

            And we’re seeing more of the same, actually even LESS, because there’s not even a PROMISE this time for good games centralized Kinect.

            What warrants the purchase, right now?

          • Shane Nokes

            Watching the Ryse demo it looks like a lot of it was built around QTE (Quick Time Events). Those work ok with Kinect in things like rhythm games because you’re already moving constantly, so you tend to fall into rhythm.

            QTE’s that are sporadic don’t tend to work well with Kinect. Also you would have had to put the rest of the game on rails with how it was designed.

            Also Ryse was being developed for the original Kinect not the newer Kinect. Porting all that work over would have taken development time…and Ryse was already taking a while to get out the door.

            So they stuck with the basics. Launch titles are usually not the ones that end up being impressive on hardware. Usually it’s the titles that come later that end up impressing.

            Also I’m not telling anyone to do anything. What I’m saying is that if you don’t want the new Kinect then that’s your decision to make. I’m never going to tell someone what to buy.

            I just say buy what works for you. If you don’t like the Xbox One then there’s other consoles out there, and I will never fault someone for buying something else.

            Why would I since I buy pretty much all of the consoles myself each gen. I like the different things each piece of tech brings to the table. :)

          • http://soundcloud.com/ViRUSfromMARS Jaffa Cake King

            Kinect doesn’t make sense. It’s a gimmick, something for the children. Elderly people marvel at it’s magic like qualities.

          • Shane Nokes

            That’s your opinion. Opinions are not facts. :)

          • Xboner2013

            Jaffe Cake King, he either works for MS or no longer works for MS as of May. Get this he was analyzing customer sanctification information. LOL

            Owner/Operator

            HotWired PC

            January 2004 – Present (9 years 6 months)

            Business Intelligence Analyst

            Collabera

            Privately Held; 5001-10,000 employees; Information Technology and Services industry

            March 2012 – May 2012 (3 months) Issaquah, WA

            This was a contract position at Microsoft. I was analyzing customer satisfaction information related to Xbox customers.

            Tier 3 Xbox Hardware Support

            VMC

            Public Company; 1001-5000 employees; Information Technology and Services industry

            August 2011 – December 2011 (5 months) Issaquah, WA

            This was a position at Microsoft. I was supporting customers as part of the Customer Advocacy & Exceptions Management team.

            Jr. Software Test Engineer

            CompuCom

            Privately Held; 10,001+ employees; Information Technology and Services industry

            May 2010 – August 2011 (1 year 4 months) Redmond, WA

            This is a position at Microsoft. I was working on an Xbox LIVE team to help ensure the security and integrity of the Xbox LIVE experience for customers.

            Testing Associate

            Volt

            Public Company; 10,001+ employees; VOL; Staffing and Recruiting industry

            July 2008 – October 2008 (4 months) Redmond, WA

            I worked on the game Fable II at Microsoft Game Studios (now Microsoft Studios) as well as the first piece of DLC (Downloadable Content) released for the game.

            Supervisor

            The Call Center

            Consumer Services industry

            May 2005 – May 2007 (2 years 1 month) Lacey, WA

            I worked as a supervisor at this answering service. This was an unusual answering service in that we handled appointment scheduling, emergency dispatch, alarm dispatch, etc.

            We had over 300 clients with a diverse range such as ISP’s, doctors, bail bondsmen, towing companies, etc.

          • Shane Nokes

            Jaffa already knows this. I posted up my LinkedIn details on my own about a week or so ago.

            I haven’t hidden anything on here at all.

            Nice try to think you’re outing me though… :P

          • http://soundcloud.com/ViRUSfromMARS Jaffa Cake King

            I already knew all that Mr Nokes but thank you for trying.

            I think MS will find out that it’s not best to include mandatory Kinect from day one. It’s going to hurt them.

            Plus you never really answered my questions.

          • Shane Nokes

            Actually I did. I went into quite a bit of detail. It just wasn’t the answer you wanted because it was all about the business.

          • http://soundcloud.com/ViRUSfromMARS Jaffa Cake King

            Your answers were in no way related to the specific questions i asked.

          • lagrew

            think your gonna be disappointed

          • http://soundcloud.com/ViRUSfromMARS Jaffa Cake King

            Already am mate.

          • Xboner2013

            Well, you are right I am not going to buy it… that does solve THE GLITCH, however I don’t just do what some little cry baby tells me because I am talking about his toy.

            Go cry somewhere else… problem solved. :) When all else falls you probably take your ball home when things don’t work out for you too.

          • Shane Nokes

            I’m not crying…but you are the one who feels the need to post on a board about a product you’re not getting, and lie about it in the process.

            While at the same time you lecture about lying. The only thing you’re doing is trolling for attention.

            I’m sorry that your mom didn’t love you as a child.

          • Xboner2013

            You are crying… go ahead and cry, I get a kick out of it. I haven’t lied about anything.

            I am sorry I am talking about your toy, but it’s not really my problem.

          • Shane Nokes

            /Facepalm

            You should realize that trolling doesn’t have an effect on me. I spent a lot of my career dealing with trolls for at least 8 hours a day…for years.

            It doesn’t phase me…but it does always perplex me on why you think your behavior will get you anything. Sure it gets my reply…but that’s only because if I’m keeping you occupied you’re not off pestering someone else.

            I’m not dancing to your tune, but you are dancing to mine at the moment. ;)

          • Xboner2013

            Oh I affect you deeply, I can tell, I you tell by the way you keep responding…. it’s kiling you that I keep talking about your dumb toy.. .isn’t it?

            I can feel the stupid fanboy in you… the rage.. .the anger.

          • Shane Nokes

            Now you’re just trying to show that you do by manipulating me to walk away…sorry, but again you dance to my tune…not the other way around. ;)

          • Xboner2013

            …. must stop him from xboning the xbone… must stop him… he is talking about my toy…. getting upset… must stop him… he is evil… i’ll keep on acting like i am mature… must hide my own feelings because i don’t want him to know i am mad about him talking about my toy….. aahhhhhhhh…

          • Shane Nokes

            *eyeroll* If I were upset you would know it…right now I’m actually showing you off to several people who are laughing.

            You’re amusing a large group of people. :)

          • RED360

            The opposite of the negative.

          • Shane Nokes

            I have no problem with people discussing the positives and the negatives.

            When someone keeps talking about the same point though and ignores the positives of a situation that’s just odd. :)

          • RED360

            It will play the next Gen. That’s good.

        • RED360

          Well when the – is what keeps you from buying then what else would you talk about?

          • Shane Nokes

            The problem is that the product just isn’t for him. There’s nothing wrong with that. :)

          • RED360

            Normal I would agree, but if you have a lot invested, been brand loyal from the start and then they make drastic changes that would keep me from buying and continuing to be loyal.
            You will speak out and talk about those issues. So don’t tell us to stop. We will only ignore you.

          • Shane Nokes

            You can’t have anything invested in the Xbox One..other than time with LIVE Gold perhaps…but that is still usable on the 360.

            I don’t mean this as an insult…but brand loyalty is always a bad idea. It precludes the idea of something else being better sometimes.

            I love all technology, and while I do have things I prefer to use I have no issues with changing what I use if a brand moves in a direction that doesn’t fit.

          • RED360

            Hmm when comes to consoles XBL was the best.

          • Does Not Equal

            Do you also go to stores and stand around, loudly telling everyone who’ll listen why you won’t buy specific products and wondering if they can be changed to suit you?

          • Shane Nokes

            That’s how I view it as well. Sure this isn’t a store…but for me I just research and move on.

          • RED360

            Obvious. By the time it gets to stores is to late.

      • http://soundcloud.com/ViRUSfromMARS Jaffa Cake King

        Nope, i was/am a huge Xbox fan.

      • http://www.youtube.com/love4musicuk Jason

        You’d think so.

  • Illusionist

    Larry, an advice for all you of Microsoft…Wake up ! You need to do something!
    All the polls on the web give PS4 like a winner, and not for a few votes.
    In my opinion you are at risk…
    Come on Microsoft, shows what you can do!

    P.s. We believe in you!

    • http://www.youtube.com/love4musicuk Jason

      I’ve noticed this too. They need to do something big if they want to lead this gen.

      • Illusionist

        What can they do for change the situation ?

        I know for example that too much people don’t want to pay Xbox One that cost 100$ extra, when Ps4 has a better hardware.

        Another problem is that people not want Kinect as a “principal device”…

        • Xboner2013

          Official MS stance.

          #DEALWITHIT

          • Dylan

            That’s what it was but I guarantee you they’ll start the
            “Made by Gamers, for gamers” type of campaign soon.

            Even though that’s not really true.

          • Shane Nokes

            Yes a hashtag that was used in a joke reply to a friend by Orthy and it blew up because people didn’t realize the guy he was talking to was a friend. :P

            Let’s not let reality intrude…by the way the crowd keeping an eye on you is getting bigger. Evidently you can amuse a ton of folks with your inane ramblings. So keep it up…we enjoy the train wreck that is Xboner2013 ;)

          • Xboner2013

            The train wreck is the XBONE 180… .it’s the bone that keeps giving.

          • Shane Nokes

            Your mom wishes you’d quit trying to give her your bone. ;)

          • Xboner2013

            That’s what I’m talking about… let it go…. let me have it. Let the anger flow….

          • Shane Nokes

            It’s sad that your mom never taught you no means no…and she already said no…she doesn’t want your bone…now zip it up junior. ;)

          • Xboner2013

            Yeah, talk about my mom…. boy, you got me there… i’m so hurt… sorry you can’t stand someone talking about your XBONE… XBONE…. XBONE.

          • Shane Nokes

            Well someone has to be concerned for your mom…sounds like you’re not.

            So someone should be a man and worry about her.

          • Xboner2013

            Seems like you are worried about someone talking about your toy…you can talk about my mom all day and night long… and then you humor me by telling how big and tough and mature you are. Nokes the big man.

          • Shane Nokes

            Where did I say anything about being big and tough?

            Oh my…Xboner is getting his comments mixed up with mine now…

            Sounds like we’ve got a mental patient here folks…probably from fetal alcohol syndrome.

          • Xboner2013

            Keep them coming… show us how big Man you are… you’re so mature Nokes I wish I could grow up to be just like you.

          • Shane Nokes

            You probably do. A great girl, successful career, nice place, all sorts of cool electronics.

            I get to work on things most nerds only dream about…

            So yeah…keep showing me how successful you are. What’s the most important thing you’ve ever done?

            If trolling is it I hope you enjoy being homeless later in life. :)

          • Xboner2013

            Big man trolling, telling trolls not troll. I get a kick out of those types….. keep it going… I am loving you man. You can come over and kick my dog next.

          • Shane Nokes

            So you do admit you’re a troll? My job is now complete. :)

          • Xboner2013

            No, you said I was troll. I like trolls, especially the ones that cry about trolling, I find it funny…. kind of like crying about someone talking about their toys.

          • Shane Nokes

            No you said I was a big man telling trolls not to troll.

            I told you not to troll…so by saying I told trolls not to troll you accidentally admitted it. ;)

          • Xboner2013

            No that is troll mentality you have… but I don’t mind you trolling or crying… I am getting a kick out of former MS employee looking like this…. I’m taking snapshots.

          • Shane Nokes

            See, I told you do your research. I’ve never been an MS employee. I contract to the industry in general and work wherever I want.

            I pick the projects I want to work on.

            Seems someone couldn’t read my resume or other posts I’ve made.

            Uh oh….

          • Xboner2013

            Awesome, I am starting a website with all your cut downs here and your awesome mom jokes. I am going to post your resume as well, so if anyone is interested that skill set. LOL

          • Shane Nokes

            Very cool…make sure to send me the link…to prove that you ever actually do something you say you will. ;)

          • Xboner2013

            Sounds great, send these over to GAF. We’ll discuss how awesome the kinect games are.

          • Shane Nokes

            You said your own site…sounds like you can’t even afford that.

            As far as NeoGaf goes…go ahead…this is all content in the public domain. I’m sure you’ll get some snickers from the pre-pubes like yourself over there. :)

          • Xboner2013

            Yeah, i’m poor stupid, mom has issues, you’re smart, everyone else is dumb… you work call centers, I don’t… i’m homeless… you’re great, and let’s not forget you the big man. :)

          • Shane Nokes

            Aww…sounds like you’re getting tired. I’ve got energy and can go all night. :)

            Now…keep dancing my little court jester.

          • Xboner2013

            I xbone all day and night baby….

          • Shane Nokes

            Actually you have. You’ve started talking about me. You do realize I posted a link to my LinkedIn long before you started posting right?

            I outed myself at the beginning…but it seems you thought you were being clever by exposing someone…who had already taken the liberty of already posting their work history from day 1. ;)

          • Xboner2013

            Trust me, this is funny, keep it coming.

            Maybe some jokes on how ugly I look or how funny my mom dresses me, did you learn all these by working the call centers at MS. Do they give a sheet on these as standard responses? I want a copy.

            Give us a typical day over there… do they give you like 30 minutes in the morning to warm up? Like yell in the phone all these cutdowns?

          • Shane Nokes

            Actually I didn’t work in an MS call center…keep up now.

            Now you’re going to scramble to my LinkedIn to point out that I worked Tier 3 support. I’ll then point out that Tier 1 and Tier 2 were call centers. Tier 3 is not.

            Nice try though. Keep firing more my way as I’m getting a kick out of your lack of reading ability. :)

          • Xboner2013

            Man, you would think I would have given you enough hints, you know people do duckduckgo dot com you when you seek employment now right? Just making sure you know that.

          • Shane Nokes

            I know exactly what people do when they hire folks since I’ve been in that position more than a few times myself.

            You do realize that I’m at a point where I don’t have to seek employment. They seek me…and I decide if it’s something I want to work on or not.

            It’s a nice position to be in. ;)

          • Xboner2013

            Yeah…. if that were the case you wouldn’t be throwing your titles around, but you are the big man. I am actually quite embarrassed for you, of course, you will think that is a cut down…. I really do feel sorry for you.

          • Shane Nokes

            Throwing around titles? I haven’t tossed around any titles. That’s you again. Unless you mean in my resume…and in the case of a resume that’s what you’re supposed to do.

            You’ll understand when you start working. ;)

            I find it amusing how much you keep talking about the things you are doing as if I’m the one doing them.

            There’s not a need for you to believe me for something to be reality.

          • Xboner2013

            The internet does not forget Nokes, I am sure Adam is sitting around wishing he hadn’t been the douche to say what he said, he did… and now you have.

            Good luck, Google doesn’t forget.

          • Shane Nokes

            LOL…you’re one of the funniest people I’ve met today.

            I love seeing you do your ‘anonymous’ impression now.

            Let me guess…we are legion…we don’t forgive…we don’t forget…I should have seen you coming.

            LOL

          • Shane Nokes

            I was referring to putting your bone back in your pants…your mom already told you no.

          • Xboner2013

            Keep them coming, I love Mom jokes… like your Xboner your Mom fatter than Xbox One

          • Shane Nokes

            You know that your mom is sensitive about her weight problem man…way to make her feel better.

          • 360_Assassin

            I find it hard to believe that you got hired by MS for anything with the way you attack people

          • Shane Nokes

            It is a good thing that reality doesn’t require you to believe in it. :)

          • 360_Assassin

            that’s true an it’s the net, so you could say you work for the MS, or the government or what ever , how would any of us really know? we don’t know matter what you say, how about you give it up an stop trying to always be right an picking on people and grow up dude

            I mean really? mom jokes?

            LOL

            I wish there was a ignore button on here, that would be cool

          • Shane Nokes

            Simple enough. You can just watch the credits for Fable II. I’m in there.

            Not that your belief changes things. As I said reality doesn’t require belief. :)

          • 360_Assassin

            lol so your in fable now as well?
            u seem to get around there buddy ;)

          • Shane Nokes

            www rtoadm com/Fable2Credits jpg

            /watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=DkxVIMbWNX0#t=345s

            Like I said, reality doesn’t require your belief. It’s just as true even if you don’t believe it. That is hard to post the full URL due to the site name causing the spam filter here to go into fits.

            YOU can guess what website though as it’s easy to find on the TUBE. :P

          • RED360

            #xbox90not180

      • No Forced Kinect

        u know why they are still behind in polls? because of Kinect. if they offered two bundles or just made it so it was NOT mandatory, it would make a huge difference and they would gain back a lot of people. but because they are still so stubborn they won’t do that an on launch ann even after they will suffer for it.

  • MotherNelson

    anyone Remember 10+ years ago when sony decided to focus on TV? lol

    http://en.wikipedia [dot] org/wiki/PSX_(DVR)

  • Xboner2013

    I want to apologize to everyone (besides Nokes) of taking up room on the board to display whatever that was with Nokes. I deeply feel that there is something very wrong as to what MS has been doing, in the end, Nokes is correct, I just won’t buy the thing.

    However, I would I further think MS should look at the posts by Nokes because in the end, MS has acted just like Nokes. Ultimately, they made some bad choices and instead of picking up the pieces and moving on, and doing the best they can. They instead turned not on the competition and fight them, they are fighting their own customers.

    It is very apparent that nothing is really going to change over there without an epic train wreck, I think this is that train wreck. What kind of company has people that attack their own customers in this way. Nokes appears to be just a by product of the attitude there. #DEALWITHIT

    There are some real good people that have come out here to actually lend their support and suggestions, but if there is nobody home accept for the likes of Nokes and Adam Orth then the Xbox division is a lost cause. Heck, Orth was the most honest of the bunch actually. What is even more strange is these people have no idea what they are doing is even wrong.

    With that said, I can’t stop the train wreck, but I know when to get off, and I will be watching this with popcorn in hand. It is somewhat disappointing to see what Bachus, Allard, the original Bungie team, etc. built destroyed from within. I guess it’s not our problem. Got to go for tonight guys and gals, good luck to Mr. Nokes, I think he is in for a rude awakening.

    XBONE 180 FOREVER

    • Shane Nokes

      LOL. I affect you so much that you had to write up an entire letter about it?

      Sorry dude, but you’ve got problems, especially if you think I’m a Microsoft employee.

      I keep saying it, but I contract to the industry in general. They call me and tell me what jobs they have and I choose what I want to do. I work for anyone that has a project that interests me.

      I do apologize to people here though that this guy seems to think he’s someone important enough that you would care about this negative rants.

      • Xboner2013

        You work for them (or have), either directly or indirectly, and your future employers and.or contracting firms will web search this and find your name.

        • Does Not Equal

          And they’ll say, “Why was Shane arguing with some idiot on Major Nelson’s blog?”

          • Xboner2013

            That is all Adam was doing. :)

          • Shane Nokes

            No Adam was having a chat with a friend and talked about a feature/restriction that wasn’t yet made public knowledge. It wasn’t him talking to his friend or even his tone…it was acknowledging something ahead of a reveal.

            That just proves you don’t understand the industry at all.

            This right here will get me a laugh and a smile. A wink and a nod..if it even gets noticed at all.

          • Xboner2013

            Nokes you are right as always.

          • Shane Nokes

            Actually I’m not always right…but in this case I know the players.

        • Shane Nokes

          Indeed…then they will read it and laugh. I think that this guy doesn’t realize the type of people that work in the industry at large.

          • Xboner2013

            If you say so. :) Not what people think about Adam.

          • Shane Nokes

            You keep talking about Orthy like you understand what happened there and you don’t…but that’s ok.

        • Scott Hutchinson

          I’m glad this Nokes has been showed to be one of the scum bags that work for them. They must all think its funny what they tried to do to the consumer, and still are doing with Kinect and the NSA.

    • MotherNelson

      Don’t apologize to that little b*tch. Mother Nelson has your back.

      • Shane Nokes

        That’s just what you don’t need Xboner…this troll helping you out.

        They seem to believe that they are related to Larry…

        • MotherNelson

          I like how you log out to like your own posts to feel significant lol.

          • Does Not Equal

            Actually, that was me who upvoted it. Hope that helps!

          • MotherNelson

            unhuh. hi. *waves*

          • Shane Nokes

            Sounds like you don’t know how to hover and see who likes posts. I stay logged in all the time.

            That you think the votes actually matter though is funny. ;)

      • Xboner2013

        I didn’t apologize to him, not for instance, but it is wasting other people’s time.

  • MotherNelson

    So did you guys hear the podcast? All the DRM policies that we hated are gone, but ALL the features are still there. I’m assuming even family share. So yay. hopefully no more complaining about that… HOWEVER…

    No mandatory kinect please.

  • xbox rules

    We are going to see more games like defiance coming on the xbox one. Such as the division and the crew. Now drm is up to the developers which is good I guess we can’t win them all now its going to be pointing fingers. Microsoft will say its not us its the developers smart move on ms part. Drm developers are going to piss those who don’t agree with drm but I do. Quess those with out internet can’t get those games to bad.

    • Dylan

      The games that need internet to function, deserve to require internet.
      It is only logical.

      The problem was games like Witcher 3 requiring it, it didn’t make much sense.

      Now we might see some games that “fake” the internet requirement like “SimCity” but at least we have the choice to skip those games, instead of every game having that requirement.

      Expect Free 2 play games like you mentioned, but not too many. I don’t expect many to develop for Xbox One, due to being blocked by the Xbox Live Gold paywall. Some, but not many.

      If they remove that requirement, then I could see a lot of developers eyeing the platform.

  • John Smith

    hey microshi*t, through out the years certain systems such as sega cd, saturn, turbo graphix 16, sega dreamcast, etc have bombed and some have even been good systems. the xbox one is not a good system.you did not listen to the fan base. made it more of a peeping tom cable box, didn’t let the gamers take their past 8 years of purchases with them, and sugar coated sh*t in a box as gold. this system will fail much like hitler’s utophia… lesson to be learned DON’T DICTATE A MOTHER F*CKING GAMER!!!WE DON’T F*CK AROUND!!

  • Bert

    Haven’t been on here for a day or so… Did they drop the Kinect yet?

    • Dylan

      No. They could, but I don’t see it happening.

    • 360_Assassin

      it’s still there as far as I know , which sucks

    • BlessTheKid

      Nope, were stuck with Johnny 5’s head staring at us.

    • MotherNelson

      Lame.

  • Berserk Rage

    I think that MS will release an Xbox One Core/Arcade bundle without Kinect for sure just to give their customers a price equal or less than the PS4 and they will say that our feedback matters when they release it :)

    • BlessTheKid

      That would be cool, but I don’t think it will happen. Microsoft claims they want every to have the same experience, and as a result only one sku will be made available.

      • Shane Nokes

        This ^

      • RED360

        You will be assimilated. don’t mind if it comes with, but would like to unplug it when not using.

        • Jeremy Trifilo

          You can unplug it.. You just will not be able to use your console when it’s not plugged in.

          • Dylan

            Did you even read his comment?

            Anyway, that’s classic PR tiptoeing.
            Just like the “Our console isn’t always online……but it does require internet”

          • RED360

            Lol ya I would like to be able to still use the counsel with it unplugged.
            Simple, but they seem to think that know one will make games if it is not forced on every one.

          • RED360

            What I said.

      • http://soundcloud.com/ViRUSfromMARS Jaffa Cake King

        I’m not having any experience if i don’t buy it because of Kinect.

    • xbox rules

      Microsoft won’t they stoped making the 4gb slim since no one buys that one the games are going to require bigger storage on the system. We will see bigger games

  • Robert Distefano

    How do we know MS won’t bring back the DRM later on in Xbox One’s life cycle?

    • Dylan

      We don’t.
      If all it takes to remove it is one update, then all it needs to reinstate it is one update.

      Though I imagine they couldn’t afford a controversy like that.

      • xbox rules

        You still need the internet to mandatory install the game to your harddrive with out it ur screwed. Microsoft failed to clarify the mandatory install the games which would require the internet.

        • Dylan

          Uh that’s stuff is gone dude.

          You only need the Day 1 update, then you can play offline forever (except for games that require the internet to play)

          • xbox rules

            No its not Microsoft has failed to clarify that you still have to read that small print at the bottom. As well the some what new policy is not 100 percent finalized. And like I said its up to the developers now. Play defiance and you will know what I’m talking about. I hope the developers do this .

          • Dylan

            That game required internet because it is an MMO, not for DRM.
            Games that require internet for DRM purposes fail, and will fail.

            Ubisoft games on PC were pirated more than ever
            and
            SimCity was a colossal disaster of epic proportions.

            They will not require internet unless it is integral to the game, like Defiance or “The Division”.

          • Jason Renfro

            Titanfall is a mandatory install and will not work without the internet.

    • xbox rules

      Hate to burst ur bubble 80 percent of the new games will require a online connection we will see more games like defiance. It really doesn’t matter if Microsoft doesn’t bring it back now its in the developers hands.

    • Jason Renfro

      They do not need to. The developer has the ability to make any game they make not work unless you are hooked into the cloud. They can scale any of the business models for continued play of the game to the developers needs. If they wanted to they could sell Titanfall for $10 at retail and nickel and dime you like WoW or any FTP you can think of.

  • Jeremy Trifilo

    Anyone know if digital content will possibly come in a similar fashion to the old policies?

    I was hoping for a disc installer for fast installations (although not needed) and special edition packages, but at the same time I want all my games to be digital. I have always hated discs and with these new Xbox One features and digital on day of release. I have all the more reason to finally make the switch to Digital.

    I REALLY hope they provide digital versions of games in the special edition packages. That will be what makes this decision difficult, if that’s not available.

    • Jason Renfro

      It shouldn’t matter if they let you download the game two weeks before it comes out and then unlock it at midnight.

  • xbox rules

    Microsoft and the developers are talking at a table right now they are trying to work with the developers its what the developers want. If they do not reach Microsoft or sony require ments they will stop making games for the system.

    • MotherNelson

      I highly doubt that.

    • RED360

      Ya well there anti consumerism will end up losing sales.
      People have proven that.

  • xbox rules

    Microsoft going to try thier best to prevent modders hackers and pirates so I say everyone shut up and let Microsoft do thier thing. Some of you already jumped ship so u can go to sonys ship well I’m not going to jump ship. Drm is the future I will not be surprised if games are going to be online only then that will piss you loosers off that whine and complain about the policies. Microsoft will do the best to satisfy both sides of the party those who support drm and those who don’t. So all of us win at the end. Some sections of the drm will still be inplaced some like you don’t have to log on once every 24 hours will not be inplaced. So yea Microsoft is right and if they are reading this its 2013 and if u don’t have the net or have a crappy connection get a better one or what they would said that’s what the 360 for. However I am supporting drm Microsoft I have a feeling that your not explaining clearly about the drm and I know for a fact that your not telling the full policy. I’m going to stay with the ship if I’m the only one on board.

    • MotherNelson

      where have you been? DRM was already cancelled. The Devs have already made statements saying that they’ve never wanted those policies. (sure, it was probably face-saving PR BS)

      Point is… what the h*ll are you talking about? your argument is about 2 weeks old at least.

      • xbox rules

        Show me where it said developers said they didn’t agree with the policies when its up to them. The division and the crew are 1 or the2 titles I can name that rrequire drm.sooo ur wrong they well approve of drm

        • MotherNelson

          You’re capable of googling that yourself. What the heck do you think this is? I’m mother nelson. The Division and The crew are MMO’s they require ONLINE, not DRM. the CONSOLE ITSELF doesn’t REQUIRE DRM. which is what we were fighting for. What the heck are you smoking?

        • Dylan

          Those two titles require the internet because the game needs it!
          My god, not for DRM.

          That’s like saying World of Warcraft is always online because of DRM.

          • Jason Renfro

            Speaking of WoW, that game would be much better on an Xbox One because it would cut out all the farmers.

          • disqus_eUPQtFSCTG

            that will be bad for any console that dosnt use a keyboard have you play that kinda game ever?

          • Jason Renfro

            I have 9 max level toons in WoW, 2 in SWTOR, 1 in GW2 and 1 in Aion. This is an x86 system written on a Win 8 kernel and the 360 already accepts USB keyborads.

          • disqus_eUPQtFSCTG

            but no one would use it since they have a controller you need a 1-9 keys to even have viable dps/ threat maybe not 9 but half… forgot 0, -,= so 12 keys… yea there are macros but that wont help much either

          • Jason Renfro

            No One? You must be a child or not a real gamer. I own everything. Every system ever made including the Apple Pippin. I don’t care who makes it I just want to play a good game. WoW on the Xbox One would make bot farming disappear because the Xbox One will not run unsigned code. I have an Xbox on every desk I own and I all have to do is hit the video input button to play them. Open your mind and enjoy the games.

          • disqus_eUPQtFSCTG

            wooah no need to be mad bro or call me a child lol coming from someone who plays wow lmao and yes there may be a few ppl that use a keyboard but if you try to in a raid and such with a controller your going to kill the ppl try to play on a keyboard

          • Jason Renfro

            I play a ton of WoW but this is the first time I have ever heard of anyone using an Xbox 360 controller to play it.

          • Jason Renfro

            Would love to meet them in arena when I just need to cap points though. Sure would save time.

          • disqus_eUPQtFSCTG

            thats the reason its not on consoles dont have enough buttons

          • Jason Renfro

            Imagine an Xbox One version on Xbox Live. x86 architecture supporting all Win 8 peripherals. The developer can choose to support keyboard and mouse or not. The two don’t work well together (remember shadowrun) it has been tried. If a remember correctly the mice were just way to fast but it could have been the other way around.

          • Jason Renfro

            Or going to the AH and using Kinect to post. Simply saying to the Kinect post 6 stack of Green tea leaf an 39g per stack would be awesome. Kinect queue battlegrounds. Kinect Open all bags. OOM in a raid and shout out Drink mana pot.

          • Jason Renfro

            Kinect search Reckless for gems. The wonderful examples go on and on.

          • Jason Renfro

            Now I am salivating. Kinect feral Kinect guardian Kinect back to feral Kinect travel It will never happen it would be too good for druids and considered OP

          • disqus_eUPQtFSCTG

            im against have to have a kinect on all the time even pluged in dont care about that either

          • Jason Renfro

            I don’t care for Kinect either but my kids occasionally use it. That thing kills me when it comes on voice chat and I am playing with my son while I am in another room. Worst mic for chat ever

          • disqus_eUPQtFSCTG

            this^ but i think they took out the mic or something of talking to ppl cause of how bad it is

          • Jason Renfro

            sorry about the kid comment too much xboner 2013 yesterday

          • disqus_eUPQtFSCTG

            lol yeah its cool but he make some good points here and there

          • Jason Renfro

            Just buy them all when you can and enjoy the games. No company is worth being a fan of because they are not truly a fan of you or at least not more than the stockholder. They are there to make money and no one should begrudge them that. Be fans of the developers if you choose. It’s like getting into an argument about which NFL owner is the best. Who cares? They are billion dollar tools charging $12 for a cold beer. They are not throwing the touchdowns.

          • disqus_eUPQtFSCTG

            yeah i dont care about how the build of the xbox is any old mmo maybe some new would be able to play on xbox or ps4 its all about the buttons on the controller… next time your on xbox live ask a friend if they rather play with a controller or a keyboard ones that NEVER played a pc game like wow i bet they wold say controller

          • Jason Renfro

            I can see what you are saying but they would get smoked in PvP

          • disqus_eUPQtFSCTG

            i never pvpd that much when i played wow but its about the same thing as raiding from what ive played

          • Jason Renfro

            the difference is dynamic versus static PvP will make you a better wow player because other players are always better than boss mechanics that never change

          • disqus_eUPQtFSCTG

            yeah but when i did pvp i used about the same number of buttons as i did when raiding

          • disqus_eUPQtFSCTG

            well your the one that wanted it on a console what do you think ppl would use more something that came with the console and are not use to a keyboard

          • Jason Renfro

            I can admit I think the Xbox controllers have always been the best in the business but they do not hold a candle to a 13 button mouse and a Nostromo or Orbweaver.

        • Dylan

          And the DRM wasn’t up to them.
          That’s why the Xbox One was so terrible.

          Now because of their changes to make it like the 360/PS3/PS4, now it IS up to them.

          LIKE IT HAS ALWAYS BEEN AND HOW IT SHOULD BE.

    • Dylan

      Piracy on the consoles has never been lower.
      The ESA in 2012 is 50% faster and more efficient at catching it, than in 2011.

      Piracy was a scapegoat, since there was nothing credible to it, they stopped using it as an excuse.

      Used games is the new scapegoat this time.
      When they kill that off, I wonder what they’ll blame next.

      • roozbeh

        I think your talking about america but in the region I am all the consoles are modded

        • Dylan

          “The ESA’s major anti-piracy efforts extend to Canada, Mexico, Brazil, Singapore, Hong Kong and Korea”

          http://www polygon com/2013/5/28/4373248/esa-sent-3-4-million-takedown-notices-as-part-of-anti-piracy-efforts

          • roozbeh

            Well my region Is in the middle east and there a lot of pirated consoles here

          • Liquidfx Xboxdude

            lol I seriously doubt anything you say.

          • roozbeh

            Why?
            Im not defending ms here im just saying the truth.
            Im living in iran so I know.
            Playstation was even h arder to
            Mod

    • Scott Hutchinson

      If piracy was the problem how did the industry get to be the multi billion dollar industry that it is today…. You sheep suck it up man and just don’t think for yourselves!

  • disqus_eUPQtFSCTG

    maaaan is it me or dose this console really suck such as Mshizz listening to there consumers (in russia consumers listen to you… thats what Mshizz thought) it took them to see perorder numbers to listen to us money is all they care for dont ever forget that

    • Richard

      God ur such an idiot it goes without saying that money motivates companies duh.
      If it doesn’t turn a profit whats the point in putting the project together in the first place. Myself personally see the xbox one being a great platform for gaming nomatter whether u pllay via disc or digital format. Long live the xbox one.

      • disqus_eUPQtFSCTG

        (your) such an idiot for not seeing what my post says lol fyi its the internet idc what you say i was just posting about how are feedback matters when it wasnt are feedback that changed there minds way to go for being a tool… this^ above comment is too funny

  • disqus_eUPQtFSCTG

    I DONT WANT KINECT!!! I AM (VERY VERY BIG BOLD LETTERS NOT) PAYING $500!!! I AM (VERY VERY VERY VERY BIG BOLD LETTERS BUYING) A PS4!!!!!!!!!

    • StudioMultimédia Gon’Interacti

      we VERY VERY VERY don’t care about it. It’s your choice.

      • disqus_eUPQtFSCTG

        then why did you say something if you dont care just sayin

  • Jason Renfro

    You look like an adult in your picture there and that’s is the way it should be. Unfortunately more kids shop in game stores than adults do and they use the trade-in system to get games they otherwise couldn’t afford. Half the time I see parents making their kids trade in for the things they want to show them the value of a dollar.

    • Dylan

      You have to be 18 or have a parent to trade in games at Gamestop.

  • Sween

    Will people stop moaning about Kinect being with the Xbox one console. Microsoft changed drm and 24hr check in. You can’t expect them to change everything. On another note has anything been confirmed about the price of digital downloads at release? Will they be the same as shop prices.

    • Dylan

      Microsoft had announced that their games would be 59.99.

      So yes.

      • Jason Renfro

        Gamestop pays ~$46-$48 per title and now MS will get that money. Stop friggin whining about used game sales.

        • Dylan

          What are you talking about…

          • Jason Renfro

            When they charge $60 for a digital download they are retaining all the money the retailer and distributor would have made thus increases their profit margin substantially. Now people can quit whining about used game sales.

          • Dylan

            His question was whether the prices were the same digitally and physically at launch.

            The answer is yes.

          • Jason Renfro

            I get that but there have been over 10000 comments about DRM and used game sales so I was chiming in about the overall announcement.

          • Dylan

            I’d say it is pretty obvious that Microsoft charges the same or perhaps more to developers than retailers do.

            It costs less to distribute, but I bet Microsoft evens that out by taking more of a cut of the money.

        • Jason Renfro

          On a lighter note my son is playing Minecraft on PC right now and I told him we just got a PS Vita in and he could trade me his 3DS for it. He said “what’s a Vita?” He has owned a game store in Los Angeles for 6 years.

          • Jason Renfro

            It’s a nice system now. I can buy the games I want to own digitally for convenience and buy ones at the store I am not sure about so I can sell them back.

          • Liquidfx Xboxdude

            he must be the worst game store owner in history. period.

          • Jason Renfro

            he is 11 and the Vita doesn’t matter

          • Dylan

            How is he 11 and has “owned a game store in Los Angeles for 6 years”?

            LOL

          • BigBernard

            He’s clearly up to date with the latest systems then. What does he sell? Sega Saturns?

          • Jason Renfro

            Yes we sell all consoles

  • Crypt0117

    I wish I had a billion dollars to give you guys to keep your original vision for Xbox One. You should have stuck to your guns and absorbed the loss for 1 or 2 years. And people would have caught on to just how freaking awesome your console was and bought it like hotcakes.

    • Dylan

      I don’t want to rent a physical disc I just purchased for 60 dollars.
      I didn’t want to ask permission to play everyday.
      Nobody did.

      You’ll get what you want eventually, but Microsoft went about it in the worst possible way, through arrogance and restriction.

      • Carnage Rules

        1. You Still don’t own the game, even if you can’t comprehend that.
        2. You weren’t, nobody was.
        3. You and the rest of the scared morons who screwed up and influenced MS to change policy, now…we’ll have to wait for all the benefits we could have seen from this new policy.
        Thanks idiots

        • Dylan

          1) I don’t own the code, but I own the right to play anytime I want, re-sell, or give to anyone I want.
          Even though you can’t comprehend that.

          2) Yes, everybody had to get permission from Microsoft to play every 24 hours.
          If you don’t get permission, you don’t play. Simple as that.

          3) We understood the implications of what was happening.

          Sharing could have been optional.

          What you don’t realize, is that Microsoft was pushing for system wide DRM. They even said themselves they didn’t consider sharing a system seller!

          They took it out of spite because they didn’t get the DRM they thought they could get away with.

          You’re playing into their hand by blaming us.

          The next time they try to pass off system wide DRM for NOT your benefit, they’ll have an army of people who don’t understand what they’re losing. Choice.

        • PSN_IS_GARBAGE

          Man are you ever the idiot.. While the EULA voids the first Sales Doctrine, it has been very lax and realistically speaking.. We have always owned our physical games since the Fairchild console all the way until now.

          It’s 21st century digital boys like yourself who want to to usher in this DRM world of slavery sooner than it needs to be. The digital future may be inevitable but that does’t mean DRM has to be anything like what MS pushed on us.

          Just yesterday I sold my XBL account to somone one EBay for $300 with over 200 digital items, movies, tv shows, and other content tied to it. I’m so glad I won’t be doing business with this horrible company again and will be looking forward to supporting a company that is not only much more consumer centric but also has a sense of morality by not locking free media apps behind a paywall.

          I think idiiots like yourself need to start questioning who you’re doing business with.

          I for one don’t wan’t MS tell me how and when to game. It doesn’t matter if things have changed the damage has already been done

          1. Yes we still do own the game.. No EULA in a printed game manual can dictate that we don’t when we still can do with that disk as we please with no restrictions. Wake up and get a grip!

          2. There are no benefits to the DRM that never was.. Even family sharing was debunked when we all found out it was nothing more than 1 hour digital rentals.. Please look it up!

          3. Again there were no benefits… If you call having all your games in one place.. an advantage and if you think that’s more important than actually owning our physical property you are about as dumb as GWB on his most drunken day.

        • Carnage Rules

          It’s pathetic that MS would change policy for the morons below. Good Job MS

          • disqus_eUPQtFSCTG

            its pathetic we have mindless sheeps like you who dont think anything is wrong i blame them training you to be blind and not see the truth

          • Dylan

            Good to know you can’t listen to logic and reason.

            If you have to insult others to stay in denial, so be it.
            We tried, but you won’t even listen.

            I usually refrain from insults, but you come off as a huge fanboy that cups his ears from criticism.

          • disqus_eUPQtFSCTG

            this^

        • disqus_eUPQtFSCTG

          1. my right as a consumer i did because i could resell the game, lend it, give it away with out asking the company… thumbs up for not knowing your rights 2. yes, yes you do 3. no,no i am not more like Mshizz scared of us because they changed there policy… again thumbs up bro

          • PSN_IS_GARBAGE

            Carnage is hiding behind the legal document of the EULA which doesn’t mean squat in the world of physical cartridges and disks. He doesn’t understand that “realistically” we do own those games no matter what the EULA says due to the fact with physical content.. it simply isn’t enforced.

            Carnage thinks we are all idiots but let me ask him this.. Why was it I knew that we were only licensing our games when I was 13 years old in 1987 with the NES? Smarter than the average kid I suppose?

    • PSN_IS_GARBAGE

      I wish I had a billion dollars to educate all the soul-less and mindless DRM supporters that basically want slavery and want to impose on my consumer rights by denouncing ownership of disk based games on this console. Matter of fact I’ve love to a do a lot more to these corporate drones but I won’t mention that here.

      God woe the day I ever meet one face to face….

  • paul rolland

    You know the family share was just Demos? Look it up~

  • paul rolland

    So you lied that DRM was needed for the consoles main design, using the cloud to power the processing etc? Personal I buy a console for the ability to trade etc, hence why console games have always cost more than PC games. Ill be getting a PS3 first cus your system will cost a fortune, with the system, headset, recharge kit, Live, before Ive even got to buy the games

    • Carnage Rules

      It sounds to me, like you really don’t have a choice, financially.

      • paul rolland

        No I have the money Ill just put it into the console that feel like it isn’t ripping me off

        • Carnage Rules

          It doesn’t sound like it. You’re complaining about everything you’ll have to buy, even before buying a game. $500-600 is hardly a fortune. What part of Xbox One do you think is a rip off?

          • paul rolland

            lol well first I like in the UK so its 30% more, second I have money because I don’t waste it

          • Carnage Rules

            April 29, 2007

            Launch Xbox 360 Elite (120 GB) – $479.99

            Honestly, when you look at what I just posted above this, HONESTLY, do you still think the Xbox One is a rip off?

          • paul rolland

            Yup, $399 Ps4 with better hardware, headset, rechargeable pad. Easy maths really

          • Carnage Rules

            I asked you a simple question. …and the PS4 doesn’t come with a headset and it also doesn’t come with a piece of hardware named Kinect 2.0

            …and better hardware means????

          • paul rolland

            Let see, the Launch Xbox 360 Elite (120 GB) – $479.99 no I waited for a price drop that was silly money for the hardware. second thank god there isn’t a Kinect 2.0 with PS4, what has the Kinect done for gaming, it was just Microsoft coping Nintendo for the family and motion control market that didn’t work. Only reason for it now is to voice control my TV so they can keep it thanks. Better hardware means better ram and not using 3 different OS that take up most of that ram.

          • Carnage Rules

            You’re still not answering the question. I didn’t ask you, how you feel about the Kinect 2.0. I simply asked you judging by the release price of the Xbox Elite, is the Xbox One a rip off?

          • http://soundcloud.com/ViRUSfromMARS Jaffa Cake King

            Because it’s underpowered and bundled with peripherals i don’t want.

            The Xbox 360, even when it was just released, was worth the money.

          • http://soundcloud.com/ViRUSfromMARS Jaffa Cake King

            PS4 does come with a headset.

            The fact that it comes without Kinect makes it more desirable.

          • Carnage Rules

            The PS3 does NOT come with a headset.

          • disqus_eUPQtFSCTG

            he said ps4 not ps3 lol

          • http://soundcloud.com/ViRUSfromMARS Jaffa Cake King

            The PS3 doesn’t but the PS4 does. You said PS4.

          • Carnage Rules

            I mean’t the PS4 and it does NOT come with a headset.

          • http://soundcloud.com/ViRUSfromMARS Jaffa Cake King

            It comes with a mono headset that plugs into the controller.

          • Carnage Rules

            Last time…IT DOES NOT COME WITH A HEADSET.

          • disqus_eUPQtFSCTG

            IT DOSE!!!!

          • http://soundcloud.com/ViRUSfromMARS Jaffa Cake King

            You can repeat it as many times as you like mate but it ain’t going to make the mono headset disappear out of the box.

          • disqus_eUPQtFSCTG

            lol

          • Carnage Rules

            Show me the headset it comes with

          • http://soundcloud.com/ViRUSfromMARS Jaffa Cake King

            I don’t have one.

          • Carnage Rules

            a picture of said headset

          • disqus_eUPQtFSCTG

            *SHOW* hows that

          • No Forced Kinect

            What’s in the Box
            PlayStation 4 System (Jet Black)
            DUALSHOCK 4 Wireless Controller
            HDMI Cable
            Power Cable
            Wired Mono Headset
            USB Charging Cabl

          • Carnage Rules

            show me a pic

          • No Forced Kinect

            dude look on amazon , stop being so F*** lazy

          • disqus_eUPQtFSCTG

            IN YOUR FACE!!!! *SHOW PIC*

          • http://soundcloud.com/ViRUSfromMARS Jaffa Cake King

            http://www sonyrumors net/2013/06/11/ps4-whats-included-in-the-box-for-399/

          • Carnage Rules

            That’s an earpiece not a headset

          • disqus_eUPQtFSCTG

            its still a head set wow your suck a blind fanboy

          • http://soundcloud.com/ViRUSfromMARS Jaffa Cake King

            My ear’s on my head i don’t know where yours is.

          • disqus_eUPQtFSCTG

            up his you know where!

          • Carnage Rules

            an earpiece is not a headset. Like I said many times, the PS4 does NOT come with a headset

          • disqus_eUPQtFSCTG

            shew you mindless sheep shew

          • Carnage Rules

            This is an Xbox site, you GTHO!!! haha

          • http://soundcloud.com/ViRUSfromMARS Jaffa Cake King

            Dig that hole any deeper mate and you’re going to have to stand on an Xbox One to be able to climb out.

          • Carnage Rules

            I’m correct, just say it.

          • http://soundcloud.com/ViRUSfromMARS Jaffa Cake King

            I’m correct.

          • disqus_eUPQtFSCTG

            wow do you not have any points now so you have to do that?

          • Carnage Rules

            Points?

          • disqus_eUPQtFSCTG

            lol

          • Carnage Rules

            do you mean those little up and down votes?

          • disqus_eUPQtFSCTG

            blind fanboy/ mindless sheep go away plz enter you slaughter house of dooom!

          • Carnage Rules

            I’m not fanboy, I’ll have a worthless PS4 just like my worthless PS3

          • Steelahlive

            Now you’re just arguing to argue – folks stop feeding him.

          • Carnage Rules

            I wasn’t wrong

          • Disturbed_Court_Jester

            http://www gamespot com/forums/topic/29407995/ps4-comes-with-headset-xbox-one-does-not

          • Dylan

            Compared to the competition,
            Yes.

            The specs on the Xbox One don’t justify its current price.

          • Carnage Rules

            That’s not the question. You PSboys have a hard time with comprehension and Kinect 2.0 easily justifies the price, I don’t care if you want it or not.

          • http://soundcloud.com/ViRUSfromMARS Jaffa Cake King

            Please tell me how a sh*tty infrared, voice and motion control device justifies the price?

          • Dylan

            As someone with 91,000 gamerscore, I don’t think it does.

            It does nothing revolutionary with the games industry.
            Nothing at all.
            Even Ryse isn’t a kinect only game anymore.
            They didn’t even give a promise this time that’ll it do anything with games.

            Oh and the PS4 does come with a headset, you may argue with semantics, but it does.
            Learn some humility.

          • Carnage Rules

            Well, as someone with a 154,000 gamerscore, I think it does.

            It’s a 3.00 earpiece…get over it.

          • Steelahlive

            Well as someone whose been on since live turned on – and only 49k ish I think – Gamerscores mean absolutely NOTHING – prove nothing either – your arguing semantics of a headset/earpiece – it’s purpose is the same – so you can hear your communications and reply back to them with a mic of some nature – whether that mic is a Pevey Microphone, a boom mic, or an inline mic. They both provide sound input/output capabilites!

          • Carnage Rules

            Gamerscore means something and having a little fun with these guys is not the end of the world.

          • http://soundcloud.com/ViRUSfromMARS Jaffa Cake King

            Yes.

  • PSN_IS_GARBAGE

    All those silly little convienences mean that much to you when it sacrifices our game ownership? No thank you. By supporting these things you are imposing on my right to own the games I buy and I think that in and of itself is a little selfish imo.

    People forget when things do go completely digital in the 9th generation of consoles the industry doesn’t need to follow Steam’s concept and DRM can surely be handled differently and fairly than the way MS and the publishers wanted to do it.

    I don’t use steam and I have never been a PC gamer, but everything I hear about Steam I really don’t like except for the pricing.

  • Dylan

    The day 1 update is to remove all the DRM (24 hour check in, mandatory installs).

  • Crypt0117

    You all know they trying to mirror Steam.

    • Dylan

      Yep, except without the sales, competitive pricing, and consumer trust.

      They were obviously wrong to think that people would just accept what they were doing.

      People don’t remember that Steam sucked big-time when it came out, but then Valve worked at it to EARN people’s trust and business.

      Steam is FREE. So it was the perfect system for experimentation.

      People don’t want to spend 500 dollars on a “maybe it’ll get better”, when Microsoft’s history in digital says otherwise (MSN Music, Games on Demand)

      • disqus_eUPQtFSCTG

        with that said steam big a$$ summer sale should start soon!!!

      • Carnage Rules

        ….

        • disqus_eUPQtFSCTG

          nice resort to name calling lol

          • Carnage Rules

            Okay, I’ll correct that, but I’m pretty sure he called me something.

        • Dylan

          If you pay 500 dollars for it, it better come day one.

          What was the point in getting a jail cell for 500 dollars, in the promise of “maybe it’ll get better eventually”?

          Now they removed the DRM, smart move, pre-orders are skyrocketing.

          • Carnage Rules

            It took decades for the prices to get this high. Don’t you think its reasonable, that it might take a little time for prices to drop?

          • Dylan

            Then I’ll go to the competition, which offers me more gaming features for less money.

            With these changes, I’ll definitely get one. It’ll just have to wait until a price drop justifies my purchase.

            Just like I did with the PS3, I waited a long time.

    • Carnage Rules

      Dumass below wants all he’s posting about on day one.

  • xbox rules

    Bunch of cry babies crying stating there’s drm good job guys back to the old gen since its 2013 get over it. If u did nt like the policy in the first place don’t get the new xbox. Microsoft needs not to listen to the cry babies they need to listen to those who are mature about it and go with the flow.I reserved 3 xbox ones at different gamestore. Microsoft has money and my stocks. So Microsoft reverse he policy one more time its all about ditgal fk gamestop greedy hungry corp.

    • Dylan

      It is gone, get over it.

      • xbox rules

        Its not over since people like me call hq in washington protesting about the new policy. Rem its not 100 percent finalized.

        • Dylan

          I don’t think you understand the implications of doing another 180.
          Maybe a 90, like they should have done.
          But doing a 180 would destroy any investor trust they had left.

        • disqus_eUPQtFSCTG

          lawl like ive said they DO NOT care about you 3% that were going to buy the console they want money a protest is not going to change there minds lol you know when they did the 180 they were NOT looking at our feedback they WERE looking at who bought the console and who did not

        • xbox rules

          Until its set in stone then ill believe it until then with people like me out there are preventing them from setting this policy in stone just yet. There are still talks on the table. Because we anonymous consumers are makeing sure the policy going to be right for everyone rem its 2013 drm is the future. I’m makeing sure Microsoft here’s my voice not those who complain people like myself support drm.

    • http://soundcloud.com/ViRUSfromMARS Jaffa Cake King

      You know they only changed policy because their preorders were so poor. I really don’t understand people defending DRM like it’s some amazing life saving thing. What the f*ck is wrong with you people?

      • Shane Nokes

        Have you considered that people are not defending the DRM, but lamenting the loss of features that the DRM would have allowed them to provide?

        • http://soundcloud.com/ViRUSfromMARS Jaffa Cake King

          You mean sugar coated sh*t? Which is what it is really.

          • Shane Nokes

            …and that ends that discussion. I’ve decided that I’m not going to waste my time with people that don’t even view the other side.

            See ya.

        • disqus_eUPQtFSCTG

          DRM is poo they could still give us feature but they rather do it the sim city way because there dumb and they think we wont figure it out

          • Shane Nokes

            You think the publishers are going to agree to offer features that would allow easy sharing without a way to control distribution?

            Sorry, but no. That’s just a simple fact of business.

          • disqus_eUPQtFSCTG

            BILLY im not talking about family sharing that is a TIMED DEMO lol

          • Shane Nokes

            Billy? My name is Shane…not sure who you are referring to there.

            I worked on the family sharing…it wasn’t a timed demo. That pastebin was complete and utter garbage piled a mile high.

            If you are talking about the cloud computing features those aren’t going away…so I have no idea how your comment is even relevant.

          • disqus_eUPQtFSCTG

            ahhhh Mshizz shill nice to meet you

          • Shane Nokes

            A shill is someone who is paid to represent a company. I’m not paid by anyone.

            I contract to the industry in general. I don’t work for Microsoft at all…but I do work on projects there and for other companies as well.

            It’s good to know that you don’t know the difference between a shill and someone providing information though.

            It’s also too bad you’re afraid to use your real name. ;)

        • Dylan

          Okay. Except this guy is, saying things like “I support DRM”, when he obviously doesn’t understand what that means.

          I actually think family sharing was interesting, but didn’t justify the system wide DRM, and treating physical as digital.

          We’ve had this conversation before, it shouldn’t be black and white, but Microsoft is making it that way.

          It is inherently obvious they wanted the DRM, not to give a cookie family sharing feature, as evidenced by Phil Spencer not considering it a selling feature of the console.

          That doesn’t change the pre-order numbers, and the PS4 conference that forced these changes.

          • disqus_eUPQtFSCTG

            again THIS^

          • Xboner2013

            Well there is a reason why they didn’t release details, prior to E3, at E3 and after E3. If in fact the so called holy grail of family sharing actually ever existed, there is absolutely no reason why it needed to be cut. I expect to see this so called feature at launch.

            Yeah, I am sure EA was going to be happy were one purchased game could have 100s of people download the game and play it, and I am sure MS was going to do this without fee as well, right, do they have bridges for sale too?

          • Shane Nokes

            It existed. I worked on it…quit pretending that it didn’t exist.

            Also it was 10 people…not hundreds…stop trying to change details to make things fit your view.

          • Xboner2013

            No it does not exist. No proof, if it exists then we will see it at launch. Do some basic research man.

            Yes, it would have been 100s as 10 people could have been replaced every 30 days, sorry.

          • Shane Nokes

            I made a hamburger…the customer decided they didn’t want it and left so I put it in the bin.

            That hamburger now never existed since I didn’t serve it to a customer. That’s your logic.

            You also don’t know the method around how things were going to work for the sharing either…so anything you have to say is invalid.

          • Xboner2013

            Nothing I have said is invalid as their is no evidence. Sorry.

            They might as well said they were going to send everyone 100lbs. of gold.

            Pedro: Vote for me, and all your wildest dreams will come true.

          • Shane Nokes

            LOL…you don’t even understand how basic logic works. Sorry, but that’s not my fault.

          • Xboner2013

            So you make a hamburger and then you say it doesn’t exist, you think that is “logic”?

            LOL Not my fault you have no education nor common sense. No family share plan existed, sorry.

          • Shane Nokes

            No you don’t pull it out of the bin and serve it to a customer. It gets counted as waste product and the company reports it. It counts as a loss for the business and a tax credit.

            It sounds like you’ve never worked in the restaurant industry or the gaming industry lol.

          • Xboner2013

            Who said serve it to the customer? What are you even talking about?

            Do some basic research, man. It’s like you can’t understand a basic concept. Your example was debunked…. sorry, no proof this so called family share plan exists as advertised.

            Sounds like you do not have any basic education.

          • xbox rules

            No one cares what your 10 year old kid opinion is. Now get off this forum its ment for educated adults now get off this forum

          • disqus_eUPQtFSCTG

            coming from someone who cares to call ppl names how old are you bro?

          • Dylan

            Says the guy with dodgy spelling, uneducated opinion, and resorts to name calling.

          • xbox rules

            I’m on my cell, I’m sorry for the miss spelled words. I work 60 hours a week at gamestop .never home with my pc.

          • Shane Nokes

            You’re not helping your case here.

        • Alex watchtower

          Exactly.

          Lost all second hand after value for digital downloads.

          Full Xbox game digital downloads now have FULL DRM. Just like Xbox Live Arcade downloads.

          People only think of physical discs, but now digital game downloads are completely and totally worthless after you play through them. So you better only buy a digital game that has like 10000000 hours of replay value.

          Can’t buy K.I. anymore.

          You buy it, you’re stuck with it. Can’t trade. Can’t share. Can’t swap. Can’t use it to get access to other users’ old games.

          You wanna share? Share your WHOLE Xbox One. Just swap that with your friends now….

          • Shane Nokes

            Well as far as I’m aware digital downloads was not going to (at least initially) have a way to sell to another user. That was still only for discs.

          • Alex watchtower

            And they never will. But that doesn’t mean trading, sharing, and the ability to “rent”‘ them from a 10 friend library for FREE doesn’t have VALUE.

            What’s the difference between getting $20 on a trade in and SAVING $30 on a NEW copy by 2 friends purchasing 2 different games and waiting to play it from a friend’s library?

            Same thing. You just don’t have to go through the hassle of exchanging money. And losing a portion of it to GameStop.

          • Shane Nokes

            No I agree that the shared library had value. I wasn’t arguing that at all. :)

          • Alex watchtower

            It’s really the same thing.

            If I buy and trade 2 games, I buy 2 games at $120 and get $40 back if I’m dealing with GameStop, for a total of $80.

            OR a friend and I can spend $60 each on different games, and we both have access to both games.

            But now this is gone. Digital games have basically no value after you play them.

          • Steelahlive

            Alex – you’re still crying about something not having value that has never had value yet – and you never experienced lol – your yearning for the future may be hurt – but your wallet has taken 0 hit in value – and remains unchanged once your future gets here -

    • disqus_eUPQtFSCTG

      gooo to pc if you want drm all the AAA titles will have it

  • http://soundcloud.com/ViRUSfromMARS Jaffa Cake King

    Compare the internal hardware of the 360 and the One. How on earth can you say it’s last gen? It’s completely different.

  • disqus_eUPQtFSCTG

    I sure do love trolling with a cause!

  • xbox rules

    Its ok its up to the developers more games like defiance is coming soon to xbox one

    • disqus_eUPQtFSCTG

      yeah and watch ppl not buy there games when there is DRM cause i know i wont

      • xbox rules

        Let us see list of games with drm feature. The crew, the division, watchdogs and many more this is jist the beginning it doesn’t matter iif u don’t buy the game because atleast my friends and I will that’s all I can say

        • Dylan

          Defiance- MMO
          The Division- MMO
          The Crew- MMO

          Show me one link to where WatchDogs will require internet to play.
          There isn’t one.

          • disqus_eUPQtFSCTG

            and again THIS^

        • Xboner2013

          I have never really understood the whole MMO thing, with MMOs comes costs, with costs comes fees, and without fees eventually the back-end gets shutdown.

          The only game I am looking forward too with any type of MMO features, is Destiny, and even that is light on the MMO stuff. I’m still on the fence as to that one. They are going to have sell quite a few copies to pay that one off.

    • Disturbed_Court_Jester

      Defiance is an MMO. Online only is how most MMO’s work if you haven’t noticed…

  • Carnage Rules

    Only poor people care about trading used games. I hate that there is so many poor people.

    • disqus_eUPQtFSCTG

      no not poor but smart who the hell would buy a game that dosnt last a day for $60 lol or poorly made

      • Carnage Rules

        Sorry, I own over 800 games and not one of them is used, borrowed, or stolen. I’ve never been inside a Gamestop and I don’t need the 7.00 I’m going to get for the 65.00 purchase.

        • disqus_eUPQtFSCTG

          umm dose your mom and dad buy your games cause it seems you dont know the value of money

          • Carnage Rules

            Yeah, mommy spent over $50,000 on Xbox 360 last gen, so I didn’t have to spend any of my huge yearly salary.

          • Steelahlive

            Thats insane if you really spent 48k on all those games – Thats considering buying 59.99 games – You should have bought MS stock instead =P

          • Carnage Rules

            MS stock isn’t worth it and my kids our just spoiled.

          • Steelahlive

            lol – if you had spent 48k at 30 per share and resold at just 35 dollars a share you’d have made 8-10k. But I digress – this imbittered hatred towards gamestops and “support” for the developers is a joke –

            1 copy of a game and one digital copy of a game – devs support either sale – as it “earned” money for them – they have a finite list of release numbers, they “count on” – so they lost absolutely nothing – they made their money on their initial sale – and counting future sales of used games is like having a hit song as a musician and expecting to make money off that hit 10-20 years later! – THEY GOT paid better than the musician probably did with a lot less effort.

          • Carnage Rules

            I didn’t spend 50k all in one day, it’s 50k from 2006 to present. Have you ever seen details on where the monies from a 60.00 game goes?

          • Jason Renfro

            The developers and the publishers have every chance to lower the price of the new goods to match the used until it is no longer beneficial for gamestop to squander money on used. It would be great if the publishers fairly discounted the games until it was simply more advantageous to buy the new copy. It is their broken business model not the used game model that is a complete fail.

          • Steelahlive

            Jason – I agree – gamestop as a business – works because the game’s industry know’s they need it – they will blast it in the media – but in private – they know it’s the best way to get their product in the hands of more people – long after the initial sales figures matter. If any developer said we will not allow you to sell used games – then Gamestop would say fine – we’re not selling your NEW title’s either.

          • Dylan

            That was how Microsoft Surface and Windows Phone pretty much flopped.
            They basically only sold it at the Microsoft Store.
            Imagine if Gamestop didn’t sell Xbox One consoles.

            Of course the “participating retailer” backhand deal fixed that for them.

          • Steelahlive

            Yeah, and made some share holders happy – but not enough i’m afraid =P

    • Shane Nokes

      Sorry, but even I can’t get agree with that one. Lots of people trade used games…regardless of their income.

      I can get behind people upset about the removal of features…but this one…nope I can’t get behind it.

      • Carnage Rules

        People who trade in games for 7.00 need the 7.00.

        • Dylan

          People who trade in games for 7 dollars use it to buy a brand new game. Even 2K and Ubisoft acknowledged that.

          “Lots of people are buying a game, reselling it, and buying another one. It has a very positive impact on the industry,” Guillemot said. “Because it [gives] the customer the possibility to buy many games. It gives them a chance to play more games.”

          I kept Bioshock: Infinite because it was great and worth it.

          I traded in Madden 2012 because it wasn’t worth keeping and I used the credit for another game.

          • Carnage Rules

            I doubt that. The 7.00 would probably go to a used game 90% of the time.

          • disqus_eUPQtFSCTG

            used games can be $7 go to gamestop and buy fallout 3 used bro boom there gose that $7

          • Shane Nokes

            They weren’t arguing that point…in fact they were saying it could be used for a used game…so you just repeated their point in trying to disagree…

          • Carnage Rules

            A used game purchase doesn’t benefit anyone but Gamestop. Don’t you see the problem?

          • Shane Nokes

            That I will agree with.

          • Carnage Rules

            lol It’s ALL about the money

          • Dylan

            And Gamestop would have been a “Participating retailer” and would have benefited greatly by the original Xbox One system.

          • disqus_eUPQtFSCTG

            THIS^

          • disqus_eUPQtFSCTG

            hey i got there dlc so in the end dose it matter?

          • paul rolland

            Depends where you buy your used games. Thank god for the used market without it I couldn’t of brought all the classic Snes games I now own.

          • Jason Renfro

            narrow mind

        • Shane Nokes

          Not always. I’ve traded in games without needing the money for anything. I was just done with the game…didn’t intend to replay it…and didn’t know anyone that wanted it. So I just took it in and used it for something else.

          I didn’t need to do it. I just did it since I didn’t want the game taking up space on my self.

          • Carnage Rules

            I’ve thrown games away, the time it would have taken to drive over there, wait in line, do whatever has to be done, isn’t worth 7.00 too me.

          • disqus_eUPQtFSCTG

            so you dont know the value of money im srry but i think you lied about that 50K salary… bill gates knows the value of money and he is super rich

          • Carnage Rules

            50K is what I spent on Xbox last gen, not my salary, my salary is three times that.

          • Steelahlive

            And being a pompous jerk about it isn’t going to win over fans – SO you make great money, and can afford whatever you wish to in life (within the degree of your expenses). But you’re on the internet arguing away as if you just got your dog punched- why does it matter to you – you buy everything anyways – this doesn’t change anything for you …you were going to buy it anways and the games anyways. and that 7dollar figure you throw around – lol that’s laughable too – on the oft occasion that I was in a gamestop – there’s never this big long drawn out line session – and the games i’ve sold netted me more than 20 bux on average. Or i’ve sold them on Ebay – and generally within the first 2 months of release – if they just didn’t workout – You’re arguing that because YOU are rich those less fortunate shouldn’t have the same “FUN” as you and should just shut up – to you sir I say enjoy your life – Karma’s a wonderful friend!

          • Carnage Rules

            I’m not trying to be, but its hard when the argument is about money. I’m a little pissed because I’d rather not buy 2 or 3 copies of the same game this gen. I like the ”family share” idea.

          • Steelahlive

            IT’s NOT about money though that’s the point!! – For me at least it’s not – I would not have given two poops if I could have sold/traded my games digital or physical – I just didn’t want the CHOICE to be made for me by MS or game devs that I couldn’t LEND my copy of a game out to a friend for them to play. NOR did I want them to be able to shut down a server and tell me what games I could play or not play because they decided the life expectancy of said game. THEY had all the control over what you could do – this new policy – while I’m sure will be brief – still allows me to lend a game if i so chose to a friend without requiring my gamertag – and anything but the disc – and they can play whatever crippled version of the single player there may be to get a feeling for it. NOR do they have to rush home to do so and only get a limited time to play – they can do it at their leisure.

          • disqus_eUPQtFSCTG

            TTTHHHHHIIIIISSSS^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

          • Carnage Rules

            Sorry, when you get to the root, its about money. either your money or your friends money who needs to borrow the game.

          • Steelahlive

            You’re an idoit – it’s about control of your purchase – not the value of the purchase – I like to buy games and give them away to my friends, their kids, my relatives – If i’ve seen they’ve not played the game – so they can be like you know that’s a great game – I’m gonna go out and buy that – if anythig it’s better advertising – WORD OF MOUTH – goes a lot further than expense of an item – do some marketing research – your root maybe money cause it appears you have no thought about anything else – for most everyone else it’s about control!!!

          • Carnage Rules

            You’re buying the game once and giving it away for 10 other people to play. Who benefits that? …and that’s one of the reasons we pay 60.00

          • disqus_eUPQtFSCTG

            no one cause its our RIGHT as a consumer to do what ever we want with it

          • Xboner2013

            “who benefits that?”
            It doesn’t have to benefit anyone.

          • Steelahlive

            I’m not – and never saw that as a prosperous idea – and didn’t think the developers would have ever backed that fully – so it’s nixed now anyways for the launch period. These dev’s would not have liked 1/10 the profit – and the new NEW policy has effectively stymied that as well for the time. So I’m not arguing for Digital quite yet as the system in its current form has no protections to insure I can still play a game to some degree without an online component – the reform in policy does just that – I know going in the game may not be the “best it can be” if I’m offline – but on the happenstance that I AM offline – I don’t want a 500 dollar device to be a rock!

          • Carnage Rules

            Why would you be offline? You can still game for 24 hours offline. whats the problem?

          • Steelahlive

            Uh I get depoloyed to a not so friendly country – but have some protections at a base – and feel like using my Xbox for a little winding down time….OH But we don’t have internet for Gaming purposes.

          • Carnage Rules

            Oh you’re in the military. In that case the Xbox One just isn’t for you. Thank you for your service but MS is still a business and I believe the new policy would have been a big WIN for my family.

          • Steelahlive

            Nope – I’m retired now – but was in the military – By aligning to Don Mattriks earlier statements you show you have no understanding of a global company that is in the business of selling a product as did MS – by isolating a consumer base and telling them to go with an older product because your VISIOn doesn’t meet ours is insanity -

          • Steelahlive

            AND NEITHER did he apparently when he made those comments – so guess what – they changed it – It would have been EASIER for your family – that’s nothing to do with money though – so your earlier points are moot – you wanted something easier – not because it was money driven.

          • Carnage Rules

            People didn’t respond well to LIVE at first and now they defend it. Every once in awhile they have to take a step people won’t like.

          • Dylan

            LIVE wasn’t mandatory to play games.

          • Carnage Rules

            It still isn’t.

          • Dylan

            Yes, so your comparison doesn’t make sense.
            It should have been optional, just like Live.

            It could have been an awesome feature, that people discovered.
            Instead of being shoved down everyone’s throat.

          • Carnage Rules

            You do not have to be a LIVE GOLD member to play games.

          • Dylan

            EXACTLY. That is my POINT.

            Your comparison to Xbox Live does not make sense.

          • Carnage Rules

            I’m just making the point that people had a fit when LIVE was introduced and now they embrace it. GIVE the new policy a chance.

          • Xboner2013

            “GIVE the new policy a chance.”

            What new policy?

          • Carnage Rules

            Well…poof haha

          • Dylan

            And I’m saying the new policy should have been optional, like Xbox Live was/is.

            There were too many drawbacks for it being forced.
            Luckily even the mainstream media even saw that.

          • Carnage Rules

            I could agree with that, but how?

          • Dylan

            An “opt-in” option.
            It is simple, I think.

            Offline games work as they do now.
            BUT
            When you’re online, you can choose to install, to which you get a message,
            “You’re choosing to upload your game to family share, when you do this, there will be 24 hour checks, and you cannot remove a game from family share, etc.”

            That way we could choose. Everybody wins.
            But Microsoft wasn’t doing this for family share obviously.

          • Carnage Rules

            But how do you stop that uploaded game disc from being loaned out?

          • Dylan

            What you can do is pre-code each disc.
            I believe it was developed by Sony, and was called “root Kit”? I’m not sure.

            Anyway in the installation process, I’m sure there is a way to re-write the code on it to make it basically inoperable.

          • Steelahlive

            There is – look at the inside of a current game – there’s a barcode/serial number on the inner ring of most game discs – if not EVERY – that can be read – and it’s stamped in sequential order – there’s your game disc code without a user required to punch it in. Have the drive read that as part of initialization of the game.

          • Steelahlive

            lol.

          • Steelahlive

            LOL – i responded well to live – I bought it the day it was available – and supported the price tag of the cost of 1 game per year for a service that would be “free” of problems because it had a support revenue built in. As long as Quality of Service for said product existed the price of the service was a no brainer to me – having worked and dealt specifically with large networks on a global reach scale I understood the value, and COSTs to operate such an expense. That didn’t stop me from playing my games had I not purchased it though.

          • Dylan

            I thought you wanted to pay 60 dollars per game because you could afford it.

            Then you wouldn’t have used family share.

          • Carnage Rules

            I want to pay 60.00 a game, but I’m paying 120.00 to 180.00 a game.

          • Dylan

            So share a disc like before.

            So I don’t understand your argument against used games, its the same exact thing you would do with family share.

          • Carnage Rules

            What?

          • Dylan

            If you used family share, you’re saving 100 something dollars.

            Your argument against used games was that people who couldn’t afford it, shouldn’t play games.

            So you just contradicted yourself.

          • Carnage Rules

            That wasn’t my argument, but everyone can’t afford everything. Does everyone drive around in 250k vehicles? That’s just life.

          • No Forced Kinect

            aren’t u done trolling yet? he served this country so you can live in peace an all you have to say to him is, sorry x1 isn’t for you because i make more money than you do so F** you. x1 is not an option for you.

            dude if your as rich as you say, the family plan SHOULD NOT MATTER TO YOU

          • Carnage Rules

            I’m not going to belittle his service to this country by having this argument with you.

          • RED360

            Since only one person can use it at a time your question is irrelevant.

          • Carnage Rules

            Well, it certainly doesn’t benefit the publisher or developers.

          • Xboner2013

            “Well, it certainly doesn’t benefit the publisher or developers.”

            So.

          • Carnage Rules

            So, in the long run it might have benefited us.

          • disqus_eUPQtFSCTG

            ok i have money to but ya dont see me doing what your doing its the simple fact that you think your more entitled to more just because you have money lol

          • Carnage Rules

            No, I’m saying this whole argument revolves around money

          • Steelahlive

            and you are wrong – it revolves around control of the license – i see a physical disc as a better way to show I “own” something than a digital one that can be shut off whenever a developer says it can – without any input from me or fans- so they’ve effectively attempted to now TELL you what you can watch or do – and I don’t like that..

          • 360_Assassin

            exactly there are a lot of us with money, who don’t go on a blog bragging how well off we are an putting others down who are not as lucky as we are to have a comfortable life.

            you sir are either full of sh*t, or the worst human walking this earth an I feel sorry for your kids. your attitude against others is disgusting and your a fool.

          • Xboner2013

            “No, I’m saying this whole argument revolves around money.”

            There is no argument. You have a right to sell your own stuff or even give it away, what is this actual “argument”.

          • disqus_eUPQtFSCTG

            this^

          • Steelahlive

            Thank you…I have the money as well – and own a LOT of games (STILL OWN) and some are still xbox 1 titles (ORIGINAL TITLES)…

          • Xboner2013

            But you bezzz rich my man.

          • Carnage Rules

            I believe I saw somewhere that the average used game nets about 7.00. Those 20.00 games must be pretty new

          • Steelahlive

            Army of Two The Devil’s Cartel$20.00$21.50
            Dead Island Riptide$22.00$23.70
            Forza Horizon$22.00$23.70
            Injustice: Gods Among Us$25.00$27.00
            Major League Baseball 2K13$22.00$23.70
            Metro 2033$20.00$21.50
            Metro: Last Light$23.00$24.8
            0NHL 13$20.00$21.50
            The Elder Scrolls V:
            Skyrim$17.00$18.20
            The Walking Dead: Survival Instinct$20.00$21.50

            SOME of those are almost a year old…

          • Carnage Rules

            Skyrim is 30.00 NEW why would they give 17.00 or 18.20 I’m not sure what both numbers are.

          • disqus_eUPQtFSCTG

            i think its used and new but i would still go with the lower price

          • Steelahlive

            that’s directly off of gamestop – it’s how much in trade value and if you’re a “bonus rewards member”

          • Carnage Rules

            Injustice is brand new 60.00 and they’ll give you 25.00 but skyrim is 30.00 and they’ll give you 17.00 it doesn’t make sense.

          • Xboner2013

            Sure it does.

            The amount of money is irrelevant for the most part, that is what makes a market.

          • Steelahlive

            lol – their math not mine – sorry you’re not comprehending why/how they do business – but it’s on their page – you can find it just search for TRADE IN VALUE- you can do it yourelf I’m not pasting the link – I don’t support gamestop either – but your 7dollar speel is just dead wrong and you need to realize that.

          • Jason Renfro

            Because it is easier to sell the Skyrim. They have 6866 stores with multiple cash registers telling them what sells everyday. I have had a used copy of Injustice for the PS3 sitting on my wall since the day after it came out and I am completely sold out of skyrim.

          • Carnage Rules

            Do you work for Gamestop?

          • Jason Renfro

            I own Gamer Doc in Los Angeles – voted best game store in the second largest market in America and I have a giant epeen

          • Jason Renfro

            sit in you yard with injustice and try and sell it – I pay a fat load of cash to the landlord every month and it has to come from somewhere

          • Carnage Rules

            Never heard of it. Ouch, I googled it and some people weren’t very nice in some reviews.

          • Jason Renfro

            watch Storage Wars they have me appraise game stuff

          • Jason Renfro

            I must really be a bad guy because we sell games for every system we can get our hands on. Original NES being the hottest right now.

          • Jason Renfro

            And it gets worse because starting in the fall we go to a consignment system. You leave your games and tell me what you want for them. I call you when they sell.

          • Dylan

            So you would have been deeply affected by the Xbox One’s policies, as you would have likely not been a “participating retailer”

          • Jason Renfro

            I do a ton of repairs. When I opened it took less than six weeks to figure out that the margins were horrific. As the economy got more and more hostile I moved further and further away from game sales. Sending people to gamestop for hardware and AAA titles with low reviews. Then Apple came along and helped with metal phones and ipods that crack screens when they drop. Now I focus on repairs and retro. We have done over 4000 rrod and the PS3 is catching up awfully fast with BluRay diodes.

          • Jason Renfro

            Do not underestimate the beauty of game installs they will save you tons of money on laser replacements.

          • Dylan

            That’s cool, very smart to adjust to change in the market.

            I’d shop there, but I’m 8 hours away haha

          • Jason Renfro

            The only people that usually review are negative. I leave them there because they are ignorant. That lady never had a single eye PS3 laser replaced at

          • Carnage Rules

            Sorry, life isn’t fair and the argument isn’t that the poor shouldn’t have the same fun as me, it’s that the poor CAN’T afford the same fun as me. Like it or not, that’s just the facts of it. There are over 300M people in the United States alone, should video game systems be priced for everyone? Video games are a luxury, NOT a necessity in life. Throw all the hate you want at this comment, but don’t freakin pretend that this is fantasy land and everyone can come.

          • Steelahlive

            LOL – do u realize how moronic you sound? How do u know that just because i spent time in the military I’m poor? For one? The idea you’ve been touting about is that this was one of money when its NEWSFLASH!!!…. Never been and we’ve told you, you can believe it or not. Your right, but the argument is control of my purchase, not the fracken dollar amount associated to it!

          • Carnage Rules

            Once again, you’re missing it. I’m not speaking of you. How would I know, how you stand financially? You always controlled your purchase, don’t buy the damn thing, if you don’t want it. Who the hell are you to change it, I wanted IT…

          • Steelahlive

            I wonder if you realize how moronic you sound this is never been about money you’re right that the games are a luxury but this is never been about money it’s about the control of the purchase there should not be anyone tell me what I can and can’t spend my money on or how I can use what I choose to spend my money on get it

          • Carnage Rules

            …and you’re going to tell me what I spend my money on!!!!! I wanted the Xbox One just like it was and who are you to change it and make it something I don’t want…WHO ARE YOU???

          • Steelahlive

            I haven’t told you to spend your money At all and I’ve never told you to go buy a PS4 like people consistently do I have a opportunity to voice my opinion to Microsoft and because I’m a stockholder I chose to do so I’m sorry that you are not happy with the way things turned out and i didn’t come in here flaunting your wealth, u did. nor did anyone but you ever claim this was about poor people wanting cheaper games till u brought up paying for the 2/3 times now vs what maybe an opportunity for u to save money. if anyone is butthurt it appears u for not speaking up sooner to MS and your happiness to the device beforehand I can’t help it that Microsoft changed their opinion because more people decided against it and by not purchasing than chose for it

          • Carnage Rules

            So, who should I blame for MS changing it’s product into something I don’t want? Should I blame Sony? Should I blame Microsoft? Should I blame the people who complained to Microsoft?

          • Steelahlive

            I have not once told you at all how to spend your money no where Did i suggest a PS4 nor have I told you anything. You should of been vocal that’s all I got to say. Microsoft changed their policies because Sales spoke louder, and as a stockholder I have the right to complain and have a right to tell them that this is wrong I only cared about the control you’re the one that brought this entire argument down to a poor versus a rich thing no one ever claimed it was because they couldn’t afford the games or didn’t want to pay for the games over. U were buthurtt cause an opportunity to SAVE money by not buying more gaves almost existed. Your argument was a joke, i could have said well then dont have as many children.

          • Carnage Rules

            It’s about money and its still is Mr. stockholder

          • Steelahlive

            For u, not me and the others that got this policy change. We wanted control of our purchases not a different price. Sorry u didnt get what u wanted, we did, blame MS for being greedy, the 499.99 price is a hard sale at that and they still havnt delivered on if thats gonna hold value or not so we wait and see

          • Carnage Rules

            arguments I’ve heard against the Xbox One.
            1. Its 100.00 too much $$$$
            2. I have to have internet $$$$
            3. I can’t borrow games $$$

          • Steelahlive

            First thing i can agree with it is 100 dollars to much – 2 is pretty moot, just the absolution of it was the problem most had, it meant no taking your xbox camping unless you had internet for instance as a terrible example, and point 3 your damn right i wanted to borrow games some times, friends and thier kids buy all sorts of genres, i get to try different games out – without purchasing to see if i like those games, should i buy them first to make that decision easie to swallow for u? Nopeill just borrow them and be happy like the day futurama came back, or arrested development,.

          • Shane Nokes

            Well that’s a value proposition based on effort. I live within waking distance of a Gamestop. ;)

          • Carnage Rules

            haha and is the effort worth the 7.00

          • Shane Nokes

            As nearly any person who is rich will tell you? A penny saved is a penny earned.

            They don’t need that penny, but it’s just that much more they can use elsewhere.

            The funny part is you’ve got me 100% against you on this one..and I can just about guarantee that is shocking a lot of people on here. ;)

          • disqus_eUPQtFSCTG

            THIS^

          • Carnage Rules

            I still haven’t heard another reason to change my mind

          • 360_Assassin

            lol yes shane is right, i’m shocked

          • Shane Nokes

            I keep trying to tell you guys. I’m not some whacked out person. I just happen to have my views on things and those views are informed by my experience. :)

          • Steelahlive

            it’s worth 20 bux or more to me to take a quick digital photo and post it on ebay – then put it in an envelope and mail it.

      • Carnage Rules

        It all goes back to finances. Money is the root. There can be no other reason.

    • PSN_IS_GARBAGE

      Go on Adam Orth.. No wonder you clowns are a vocal minority.

      • Shane Nokes

        You’re using the term vocal minority in the wrong manner. I know what you’re trying to say, but you’ve got it reversed.

        • PSN_IS_GARBAGE

          How so? DRM supporters and ones that have made these petitions to bring back this DRM are the minority. Wouldn’t you agree? How did I get it reversed?

          And I know you aren’t pointing fingers but I didn’t downvote the post I’m replying too.

          • Shane Nokes

            I’m trying to reply to this, but it keeps blocking the post. I’m thinking there is something the filter doesn’t like…so I’ll keep trying. So please be patient with me. :)

    • http://soundcloud.com/ViRUSfromMARS Jaffa Cake King

      Really? Is that what this discussion has descended into now?

      • Carnage Rules

        Facts are facts. Give me another reason other than money to why you buy a used game?

        • paul rolland

          Cus I cant buy it New anymore

          • Carnage Rules

            This might be a reason, I have to think about it.

        • RED360

          Game is just not worth full retail.

      • Dylan

        Polygon had predicted this.
        Microsoft was trying to create this “elitism” to enjoying games.

        And that’s the worst thing you could possibly want, everyone should enjoy games.

        “It’s aggressively anti-consumer and anti-middle class, and it outright ignores underprivileged gamers. It’s gross, despicable, greedy, pathetic, cowardly and out of touch with a growing global resentment for corporations.”

        http://www polygon com/2013/6/7/4406170/xbox-one-internet-trade-policy

    • paul rolland

      Lol your an idiot and by the sounds of it love to waste money, I think you forgot that you have to sell new games to produce the used market there is not one copy of used games going around

      • Carnage Rules

        I don’t call it wasted, I believe they got their money’s worth out of every game.

  • Master Chief

    I was going to boycott Xbox One because of the required internet connection. I don’t want a spycam in my house and I don’t want games uploading data about my gaming behavior. Unlike the Windows division, the Xbox division is smart enough to recognize when they made a mistake. I am satisfied with the changes Don Mattrick announced.

    • DaveF

      No one cares about what you do in your living room. Do you have a cell phone or a web cam? Guess what, you have a spy cam in your house. Do you use the internet? Guess what, it’s uploading ALL KINDS of data about you and your behavior. You’re an idiot.

      • RED360

        Nope don’t have those because we as consumers have the option of buying them without. I could pull the camera out of your Phone and the phone will still function.

        • DaveF

          You could turn the Kinect off.

          • RED360

            Ya a soft ware solution which can be over ridden by soft ware

          • DaveF

            Jesus, get some tape, then. If you’re such a technophobe, what are you even doing here? No one, and I mean no one is going to be the least bit interested in watching you sit on your duff and stare at the screen for six hours.

          • Steelahlive

            It’s not technophobia – it’s called having a choice – that’s the thing people don’t get – Had MS offered a choice – they could have sold more people on the idea – instead they ORDERED it be SO – and now your choice is 500 dollars ….is it worth it …what if developers do NOT use it again, as with the original kinect? what then – we have an overglorified camera/microphone that does nothing – since no one’s using it again…..now I have to find a place for it – if I have my console in another room with an infared repeater setup – and the kinect sensor – how long’s the cord…can it be extended….there are all sorts of variables that adding “more” hardware into a sale of an item doesn’t always work out.

      • Steelahlive

        Honestly – DaveF – I feel it’s a niche product at best – after the initial 8 million or so sales of Kinect 1.0 it fell off – and the product while fun at times – wasn’t just ready for prime-time – had they made it as the kinect 2.0 is showing off what it can do – the first time around – bundling it maybe a no brainer – but the pricing could have been reduced if sold as an add on. Plus – no matter how many devices I own – with camera’s and mics – I don’t like being “FORCED” to use it – or have it there when it’s plugged into the console – with only a software trigger – if i want to unplug it I should have that ability – this is the shady part that becomes apparent, it has more functions tied to it than simply voice and video – their maybe some offloading of processes going on with it – If that wasn’t the case – why not just let me use my headset for voice communication to the xbox .

        • RED360

          It is all about the DRM VDRM locking games to you backed up by the cloud.

        • DaveF

          You’re not being FORCED to use and/or buy it, it’s like you’re complaining about the CD tray or something. It’s PART of the PRODUCT. Why am I being FORCED to use this keyboard?

          • Dylan

            Except Kinect can be turned off.
            So it really isn’t part of the product, nor is it integral to the system.
            So you are being forced to buy it, and you’re being forced to plug it in.

          • Steelahlive

            I am being forced – it was optional last time – now I must use it – to the degree that it has to be plugged in – even if it’s actual USE never comes to fruition.

      • Master Chief

        When a game company collects data about their users, 99.99% of the time they are doing it for the benefit of the company not the user. I’m not capable of imagining every evil use for whatever data they could collect so I don’t want them to be able to collect any data about me. There are no laws in the US that put any limits on what they can do with the data they collect. For example, it is perfectly legal for a game company to sell the times I am home gaming online to politicians and telemarketers. The politicians and telemarketers could then call me when I am most likely to be home.

        • DaveF

          Again, the internet is *watching you* right now. Any secrets you’ve ever had are already on file. This doesn’t bother you, but game data used to BRING YOU BETTER GAMES does. Brilliant.

          • Master Chief

            It’s fine with me if you want to connect your Xbox to the internet. Why do you care if I don’t want to connect mine to the internet?

          • Dylan

            Because he must defend Xbox One, and his blind product loyalty demands him to think that anyone that opposes Xbox One is moronic.

          • DaveF

            I’m not the one with “blind product loyalty” YOU had to have the one with the Xbox logo, and YOU had to have it fit YOUR criteria, instead of buying the product that did fit but was made by someone else.

          • Steelahlive

            Their quick change should be evidence enough to the fact that this policy was never set in stone – and that they knew it could be changed.

          • DaveF

            Because of you and people like you who up and decided, without any knowledge or forethought, that they were “going to boycott Xbox One because of the required internet connection.”

          • DaveF

            Why couldn’t you buy the product that was more like you are used to/ more feasible for your situation? Why did you have to make both products the same? NOW THERE IS NO CHOICE.

          • Steelahlive

            There is absolutely a choice now – I can either get my digital game or my physical game – and KNOW that i can play my digital game till they tell me I can’t and play my physical game whenever I feel like it – even if it’s crippled in some manner – I’ll still be able to play it – and on the go whenever I feel the need – EXCEPT in those circumstances where the said game requires internet to function such as MMO’s or what not – physical disc “wanters” if you will – didn’t really gain much in this – all we gained was a Reprieve in the action’s MS is attempting to impose – and I would bet, we won’t have those options for long – the game companies will just say fine – this singleplayer game doesn’t really exist cause it’s a persistant world type offline mode that still has MMO qualities….as we have already seen with The Clancy game and Titanfall.

          • DaveF

            You’ve said this time and again, but I think you fail to realize that without the digital portion, your disks won’t work anyway. When they stop supporting the games, you’re done. Sorry to take away your sense of security.

          • Steelahlive

            ? How so? I can plug my console in on launch day get the required update – unplug and play my games….? I realize certain titles may not have all benefits and features – as their online counterparts – but i WILL be able to play my game whatever this “digital” portion is you speak of I am confused.

          • Steelahlive

            Example of such would Be Mechwarrior 2 and Halo 2 – I can’t play the ONLINE portion of those games anymore – but I can still play the single player campaign of said titles on my 360 right now….or on my Original Xbox if I chose.

  • GmailIsDown

    tell me what you think

    http://gamingbolt com/xbox-one-still-has-cloud-features-for-first-party-games-committed-to-digital-in-a-big-way

    does it mean we’ll get the best of both worlds?

    • Xboner2013

      It means they still don’t know what they are doing. There is not one thing in there that would describe to anyone as to what they are doing.

    • Dylan

      DRM and Cloud were mutually exclusive.

      It just means the obvious, Cloud is still there and had nothing to do with DRM.
      It’ll still work for MMO’s
      It’ll still add more zombies in DeadRising.
      But it is still optional, just like before.

      It’ll still do some minor processing enhancements.

      Some games will require internet to use mandatory Cloud features, just like on the PS4, games like “The Division”.

      Nothing about the Cloud has changed.

      • Xboner2013

        MS Cloud talk was a bunch of hogwash. Any developer can stand up servers and have been for over 20 years in gaming. A cluster environment can help especially with visualization but all this talk of “cloud” stuff is full of fluff.

        Do yourself a favor, ignore all the cloud stuff talk.

      • Shane Nokes

        No, DRM and specific features were tied together. Cloud computing was never tied to DRM.

        Repeating a lie doesn’t make it true.

        • Dylan

          Cloud sharing was tied to DRM.

          Everything else related to Cloud, not related.

          • Dylan

            Which was basically his question

          • Shane Nokes

            Correct…somehow I misread that earlier comment. Likely due to being up almost 48 hours now…so I do apologize.

          • GmailIsDown

            why have you been up 2 days straight during a weekend

          • Shane Nokes

            Incurable insomnia. When I was younger I had epilepsy that resulted in some pretty major seizures. Those seizures actually caused some physical damage. I basically had to learn how to ‘re-wire’ my brain for some things, but luckily it was at a very young age.

            The lasting legacy of that is intermittent aphasia (luckily almost no one notices that since it’s usually a few seconds per episode), intermittent insomnia, and myoclonic jerks…which is basically muscle spams…but I can mostly hide those. The other thing I’ve always suspected it being related to as well is my habit of being way too honest for my own good sometimes.

            Yay for way too much detail for things eh?

          • Dylan

            Don’t worry about it.
            Get some sleep, haha Nelson’s blog will still be here in 8 hours

    • Master Chief

      He didn’t specifically rule out family share with a 24-hour internet check-in.

  • disqus_eUPQtFSCTG

    this is off topic big time but who else signed up for the world of tanks beta?

  • paul rolland

    Its funny, I really do think its a reverse of roles for the new gen, Back at the start of 360 and Ps3 it was Sony being arrogant and Microsoft showing the exciting new ideas like achievements and the Arcade. Now it Microsoft looking arrogant and lacking Ideas. They need to rethink their Indie game platform, just look at the way they treated Oddword and Fish

    • GmailIsDown

      what are the new ideas that Sony has for PS4 that Microsoft doesn’t?

      • disqus_eUPQtFSCTG

        there giving indie devs the right to publish there games something Mshizz wil never do

      • Dylan

        A heavy emphasis on the independent scene, a wide range of types of games
        A heavy MMO scene that isn’t behind a paywall

      • DaveF

        Apparently they had the idea of not bringing anything new to the table, and Microsoft decided, “wait that’s better than what we were doing”

        • GmailIsDown

          funny

        • paul rolland

          Microsoft being able to fully control the method and price of games through DRM is not a feature its a monopoly

      • paul rolland

        Open indie game platform, Share feature (Yeah I bet Xbox had the same feature and the didn’t copy it once they saw it at the Feb reveal) Free to play titles like Planetside 2 playable without a subscription, Free Games on the payed service (Now copied by Xbox)

  • http://soundcloud.com/ViRUSfromMARS Jaffa Cake King

    I don’t think I’ve mentioned this before but i think Kinect should be optional.

    What do you guys think?

    • Dylan

      Nope, I don’t think you’ve ever mentioned it
      :)

      • disqus_eUPQtFSCTG

        would not like to buy one dont think ive said that before

        • No Forced Kinect

          i think that’s the first time i have ever heard that from you ;)

      • No Forced Kinect

        i’m pretty sure this is something new ;) but i feel the same way ;)

    • Lucas Sanches Cestari

      eh,,, with the kinect the future games for xbox one will be more advanced in many ways, sooo no =3

      • 360_Assassin

        (facepalm)
        dude, no. just ….no

        • Lucas Sanches Cestari

          (facepalm)
          dude, yes. just ….yes

      • Xboner2013

        “will be more advanced in many ways”

        LOL

      • Dylan

        In so many ways that they didn’t even bother to show any real AAA games built around it.

        In so many ways, they built Ryse around Kinect, and it sucked, so they rebuilt the entire game with it hardly being used.

    • GmailIsDown

      i use kinect on 360 extensively so it’s fine for me. i actually welcome this change as developers will be willing to integrate kinect more as every Xbox One users will have a Kinect.

      but i do understand that people who never use Kinect can be frustrated for being forced to spend $100 more.

      • Xboner2013

        “developers will be willing to integrate kinect”

        No. Developers dropped it for obvious reasons. The Kinect 1.0 actually sold over 24 million, this is roughly the same amount of units that the original Xbox sold. The number of units sold is not the reason developers either 1.) never started working with it, these are the smart ones 2.) the ones that dropped it after figuring out the real world limitations.

    • 360_Assassin

      nope, I’ve never heard you say this before. ;)

    • paul rolland

      Dont think I have ever play a game that was made better because of Kinect so yeah =3

    • Does Not Equal

      I think it’s finally starting to get old, man.

      • DaveF

        Off-topic, have you ever seen “the Pet Girl of Sakurasou”? Because you remind me of someone on there.

        • Does Not Equal

          It’s on my to-watch list.

          • DaveF

            I forget his name, he’s the recluse who’s rarely ever seen. He’s realistic, or pessimistic depending on how you see things, and very blunt with his opinions. He just says things logically, with no filter to spare peoples’ feelings. It usually hurts more because he’s right.

            You just remind me of that guy, I’ve been wanting to tell you for days now.

          • Does Not Equal

            I’ll take that as a compliment. Thank you.

          • DaveF

            Welcome. And definitely check out the show, it’s equal parts hilarious and thoughtful.

  • BlessTheKid

    Okay Microsoft, now that you’ve returned to the good graces of the people. Bring on the commercials. I’m already tired of seeing Sony’s “Greatness Awaits” advertisements. Get me PUMPED for 11/2013!

    • Xboner2013

      XBONE 180 Awaits!

      • BlessTheKid

        Pre-Ordered PS4 on 6/10, and Xbox One the day they “flipped the switch” on restrictions. I’m a gamer not a fan boy. Bring on BOTH Next-Gen Consoles. There’s a lot of negative things being said on these forums, but most wouldn’t be here if they weren’t interested in X1

        • DaveF

          You just ordered two of the same thing.

          • Dylan

            Would you say the 360 and PS3 were the same things?

            Dreamcast and Gamecube?

          • DaveF

            No, they were different systems, different hardware, different capabilities, and, for the most part, different developers. Now there’s what, a half-dozen “exclusives”? Other than that, almost the EXACT same machines, and people are STILL whining on here that the X1 isn’t close enough to being a PS4 (waaa, kinect, waaa)

          • DaveF

            Wow, not another new comment in over 10 minutes? Did I finally get to you all? Yeah, despite the features you’ve stripped from Xbox one, the little b^&%*es are still not happy. “Errr why can’t I have a X1 without kinect for $100 cheaper?!” You CAN. You can go onto Amazon or wherever and preorder this exact machine, with no Kinect, for $100 cheaper… the only thing is… it’ll have a blue stripe instead of a green one. Congrats everyone!

          • DaveF

            You could have, in fact, done this the whole time. You could have gotten what you wanted WITHOUT taking away what everyone else wanted.

          • Master Chief

            Dave, please put down your bong, take a breath of fresh air and tell us what you are talking about. Your posts are completely incomprehensible to me.

          • DaveF

            The PS4, John, everything everyone’s been biting at Xbox for, could’ve been solved if they went and bought a PS4, and left what Microsoft was trying to do ALONE. Then everyone could have what they wanted.

          • Dylan

            That’s exactly what happened.
            The pre-orders for the PS4 exploded.

            Xbox One was being mocked on national television, its policies covered by mainstream media.

            Microsoft had to save face since their pre-orders were well below projections.

          • DaveF

            *sigh* Maybe you’re right. I’m not even going to fact-check that. I’m getting too upset, especially over something that I can’t change now.

            And this all happened because of Sony and Microsoft, not the voices of the masses, no matter how much we’d like to believe it. So it’s not fair to blame any of you.

            Could we… could we just quit the b@$#^ing? Could we just reserve judgement on the remaining features of this thing until after they’re utilized?

          • Dylan

            Yes :)
            Truce?

            Anyway, what we witnessed was a corporate standoff.
            Sony was so quiet about their policies…
            it forced Microsoft to commit

            Then boom!
            I don’t think Microsoft had much choice.

            As, Colin Moriarity had said, it shows lack of vision and leadership at the top.
            It seems the higher ups weren’t really confident in the new system

          • DaveF

            Truce.

            Well, I think I’ve had enough for one evening, ‘night all.

          • No Forced Kinect

            truce :) Night Dave

          • Steelahlive

            I can agree to that Dave – I have nothing against YOu or anyone that liked the announced device nor anyone that has fought for changes, in either price,device usage, or options/features. We all have an opinion of how it “should” be – and we were hoping that this generation of console’s was going to be it

            – Telling us to go buy a PS4 is not a solution – I don’t own a PS2,PS3, and won’t be owning a PS4 – I am a MS supporter through Stock, and Merchandise, I wanted my Company to succeed if you will vs Sony – that kinda logic only alienates us as fans – when we both obviously love our devices – just not the aspects of them in the same manner –

            MS also affords us this exact opportunity to some level of degree, to complain or request changes…Unfortunately a larger opinion became fact to them in sales numbers or something – the beating they took in the public, whatever it was – got some policies looked at and modified – in the end, MS has come through on the last 2 console’s and I would like to hope they pull it off again. My love for the Xbox brand is solid – I just think the price point is a bad one, and could really knock down their sales forecasts – and in NO way because I disagree with the price does the Value of a PS4 at 100 dollars cheaper ever look to be a good purchase for ME! and I suspect many other xbox loyalists here.

          • Steelahlive

            you didnt get to me i got to u. me and the vocal community that r looking out for everyone – you cannot order one without kinect – i can order a ps4 yes not an x1- this was one of my complaints 5 days ago and june 13 and will be throughout

          • Dylan

            Except all I was hearing from people like you was

            “The PS4 will do the same policies! You just wait!!”
            And they didn’t.

            So the pre-orders SUFFERED for Xbox One. So they had to remove the policies.
            And what do you know, the pre-orders are way up.

            By the way, the consoles are NOT the same, if you looked at the specs.

          • DaveF

            1 The RAM on the PS4 is newer.

            2 there’s no hdmi pass-through.

            Whew, that was a looong list.

          • Jason Renfro

            The ram runs hotter and is no benefit to CPU side functions.

        • Xboner2013

          I am not buying either one right now.

          I have another one. “Xbone, the bone that keeps giving”

          • RED360

            I’m going to wait for like a year.

            Just spent a load on PC parts.

  • No Forced Kinect

    i wonder how long Major will let this thread go on? cause we all MS is not listening to us , or Kinect would be an option. An they never would have tried DRM. I wonder if he’s just letting it go on an on so people can vent in hopes that we will all forget their really not listening to anything we say, lol

    MS only listens with money
    proven fact by the low pre-orders for them a bit ago and now the change of DRM.
    not sure why they just don’t make Kinect NOT mandatory. put in the box so everyone has it but don’t force it to be plugged in for x1 to work.

    not sure why that is such a big deal.
    everyone still has it but WE choose to use it or not.
    seems to me everyone would be happy with that
    and MS would start to get the rest of it’s loyal consumers
    back and Ps4 would not win next gen.

    • 360_Assassin

      i would gladly buy a X1 if Kinect was in the box but NOT mandatory. Been with xbox for 8 years now an I don’t want a PS4, but I sure as H*LL don’t want a X1 when I have to be forced to use something that is of little to no value to me.
      I agree, put Kinect in the Box, but don’t make it mandatory
      Win, WIN

      • Steelahlive

        agreed – they could remove it and sell it the system cheaper – and compete with Sony’s pricepoint –

        or allow me to “get it” with my purchase and never use it and have a solution for those folks to get rid of it if they don’t intend to EVER USE it

        or do as they will, and offer a 499.99 item that appears like a bad decision ….for SOME!

        • 360_Assassin

          yes, your absolutely right Steel. I totally have nothing against Kinect being sold with x1 so that way MS wins with everyone having it, and so do the Devs, BUT I it should NOT be mandatory plugged in so that the x1 even works, We really should have the right to choose if we want to use it or not.

    • Steelahlive

      It’ll get shut down, the fact that it’s still ongoing is to me evidence to the contrary – that they are listening – trying to gauge the percentages of folks to see where there line is cut now vs sales – how many people CANCELLED a preorder for the xboxONE – because of the NEW NEW policy Vs. Have Since pre-ordered….or what factors are causing people to stay on the fence. I think they’re leaving it run to have as much data – but we will see NO more significant changes than what we’ve already seen. At least thru launch I’d bet. Maybe some further “clarifications”.

      • No Forced Kinect

        It sucks for me, I’ve had a xbox and supported them since the original,i never owned a PS2 or 3 and I DONT WANT a ps4 but i will not get an x1 with Kinect Mandatory.

        if they ever come out with a separate bundle without it or with kinect but not mandatory, i would love to get the x1, i don’t want to hate on it, but i also don’t want to be told I have to use something that i find to be horrible no matter how much they tell me it will be fun.

        don’t care

        • Steelahlive

          Eh, I’m in the same boat as far as my Support for MS has been since long before they made consoles for that matter =P – but I Don’t see the usefulness nor has the “future” looked better with a kinect device in my living room – I used my 1.0 – and a friends samsung or lg or whatever brand TV it was that had a similar “hands free” camera system. It’s just not something, I can see being that great to the “average” user, and the average user is the one that doesn’t think with their wallet or not rush out to buy games – the average user in this instance just buys,consumes,rebuys, reconsumes – and they’ll be the sales that are guaranteed – but if THEY aren’t using it – you’re SOL. They could have built a mic into the controller if they wanted an always listening mic device. Or let us use our headsets to issue commands to the console – this idea that the kinect was mandatory for the hardware to function is BS.

          • No Forced Kinect

            totally agree since they said that DRM HAD to be there as well. And well ,now look. Apparently it DID NOT have to be there.

            Really lost a lot of trust in MS , i really wanted to be excited for x1 but they ruined it for me :(

          • DrToker

            The features that came with the DRM are gone. MS was going all digital, so yeah, they NEEDED some form of DRM.

        • kftgr

          Then cover the damn thing and tape up the mic holes.

          But don’t complain when you can’t swap controllers easily in a local multiplayer environment. Or when you have to go through menu after menu to manage inventory in a game. Or when a survival horror game isn’t as immersive as other people say.

      • Audioslave

        Not many cancelled. If you look at Amazon, before the announce, the X1 wasn’t here and the PS4 was in the top (at least here in Europe), after the announce the X1 is in the top charts.

    • GmailIsDown

      all companies listen with money only. it is what it is. business. so, vote with your wallet.

      • No Forced Kinect

        good point ;)

  • Steelahlive

    That plan may not happen – Backward compatibility is a harder pill to swallow sometimes – but has nearly happened in every console generation before it – yes SONY attempted to keep it alive – and in some newfangled way Nin/Sony have kept it alive a bit by making you repurchase those games for use on the new devices, since the PS3 has cut that feature as well. But probably not going to happen – and this was the scary part for the XboxOne – had they gone this route – ALL games could be potentially unavailable when the console stops being manufactured/supported. IT’s really a matter of how long can you justify keeping a 360 around to play your beloved titles? I will have a 360 till I can’t buy em anymore – I’ve just really enjoyed this console, and if I can’t get em repaired/replaced then I’ll get one that works and keep it for those Special Occasions!

    • Shane Nokes

      Actually backwards compatibility was usually very much hit or miss and was really more about the company than about the generation.

      In the case of Atari there was BC for a couple generations.

      Nintendo however never had BC until the Wii…and even they stripped it out of later versions. Now the WiiU has some BC for Wii titles…but not sure how long that will last. I’m just glad they’ve done Virtual Console stuff at least.

      Sega never really had BC.

      Sony kept BC rolling until shortly after the launch of the PS3.

      Microsoft has never really done BC. Emulation yes, but not BC.

      That’s not to say that I don’t want or like BC. I do…but expecting it when console hardware changes so much between generations is a hard thing to expect.

      • Steelahlive

        I just didnt go into detail but said about what u just did… I was giving sony and nintendo their due, for trying..

        • Shane Nokes

          Yeah Sony I give massive props to for the PS2 and early PS3’s in that regard. I just wish they didn’t cut it out later on. :(

          I also do give Ninty some props for doing things in the Wii and WiiU, but again wish they didn’t cut it out of later versions of the Wii. *sighs*

          • Dylan

            I think Backwards compatibility is important in the first few years of the console life.

            I think Sony took out the chip to cut costs to be competitive with Microsoft, similar to what I think will happen with Kinect.

            I think this generation is different though. I think there will be an influx of games that we haven’t ever seen in a launch before.

            We could see PC ports out the wazoo from the indie scene.
            Games like FTL and Hotline Miami would be simple ports, and without self-publishing, it would be easy.

            Also MMO’s and free to play should be a huge part of the next gen.

            So I think it’ll be a jam-packed gen games wise.

    • Audioslave

      The best backward compatibility is to keep the old console for a few months…

  • ZEISMAN

    Go back to the old plan or try to find a way between. And don’t care about all these “I don’t want kinect guys”. They just don’t get the idea and funtionailty. And that it is important for developers, that EVERY Xbox has one. These folks already ruined enough.

    • Audioslave

      Why go back to the old plan ? They can have their “old plan” for digital downloads and let the people play with their disc like they used to do with the 360.

      • ZEISMAN

        That would be okay.

        • Fitzgerald

          you can still get all digital content if you want… or are you arguing to reinstate family share.. the plan everyone assumes is what they *want* it to be, but don’t really know what it *is*…. as I’m sure the publishers were all lining up for 10 people being able to share 1 game.. I’m really sure that was the plan.. makes perfect business sense. ;-)

  • 360_Assassin

    I think if MS would just think outside the box, they could get people back on their side an trusting them again. I get that they want everyone to have Kinect, so put it in the box but DONT make it mandatory or that we have to use it in EVERY game.

    in fact, I love achievements, so why not put special achievements in some games , so that if you want them you could have the OPTION to Take Kinect out, plug it in , get the achievement, then you can unplug it again if you want and put the Kinect away again.

    OR you can choose to just keep playing with the controller and not even get the Kinect achievement and it would be totally up to the player how they want to do it.

    why not give people options this way? instead of forcing it to be plugged in an saying you HAVE to use it, why not give us the option to use it?

    DEVS could get smart and have different achievements in their games for Kinect only, but it would be an option!!!

    you would not have to use Kinect unless you wanted that certain achievement..

    which I would, I love achievements, lol but I also would love the choice to not get that achievement, and just use the controller as well.

    giving options to your consumers is always a positive thing

    and I think MS/X1 need some positive things right now

    • 10 Year Vet

      I agree, make Kinect a fun option in the box, but not mandatory for the system to run and not in every game. I like the achievement idea though

      • ZEISMAN

        Guys, Kinect is part of the whole system architecture. For example the recognition who is holding which controller is done by Kinect. Is that all because of these 100 bucks? Come on. And nobody is watching you. MS made that clear several times. When you guys cry about every Innovation der One brings or once brought, that go and get you a PS4. Don’t try change a whole product! “We don’t want this, we don’t want that”… Than this console is obviously not for you! Then you have to buy another one.
        And besides, don’t judge the new Kinect by the old one. The old Kinect was a toy for children. That’s true. But wait for what will come with Kinect 2. If it sucks, then you can complain.

        • Audioslave

          So, the console will be for whom ? If there is too much hassle, people won’t buy the X1.

          Price is a big problem with the crisis.

          If Kinect is really a killer feature, then they MUST massively advertise on it and not just for the menus navigation or face detection.

          • ZEISMAN

            For everybody who preordered the console since reveal. Or since E3. Me and most people I know. And if you look at the numbers (Amazon, Gamestop, Spielegrotte (Germany),…) it’s quite a number. If 499 is too much for you, then get yourself a better job or stop running around with a 500 dollar smartphone…

          • Audioslave

            It’s not too much for me but it is for a lot of people. And it’s not about X1 or a smartphone but about X1 or PS4…

          • ZEISMAN

            THEN THEY SHOULD BY A PS4!!! Why try to change a system, when you don’t like it? This behaviour is so childish!

          • No Forced Kinect

            people who have been with xbox for several years should NOT have to buy a ps4, dumba$$,
            stfu

          • Audioslave

            Because of the crisis people don’t have much money to put in games. There is a switch towards mobile/tablet gaming also.
            MS could say OK, people will buy a more expensive system, they will buy DRM etc. BUT, that’s not what will happen and if MS doesn’t sold many X1, they won’t offer a great experience in the end because publishers will choose the PS4 etc.
            Look at what happens with the indie dev, they are choosing the PS4…

          • 360_Assassin

            lmao grow up

        • bpool23

          While the Kinect 2.0 may be cool and Im pretty sure a lot of work has gone into it. i just don’t think their is a massive market out there for motion controls. I might be wrong, but the way i see it, mot people enjoy sitting down with a controller in their hand. So I can truly see why some people would complain about paying the extra money for a camera.

          • ZEISMAN

            But do you really think, the new Kinect is worth only 100$? Look at which price the PS3 had at launch. With no extra benefits.. And people bought it.. It’s a cool extra feature and as mentioned an essential part of the the whole architecture. Some people want to rebuild the console completely. That’s silly. Buy it or leave it.

          • Dylan

            Yeah and the PS3 failed miserably for a long time because of that price-point.
            It wasn’t until a month or two ago that they passed the 360 in world-wide sales.

          • Jeremy Trifilo

            On it’s own it would probably be $199.99 or $249.99.

            It is far more advanced then the original Kinect Senser and that was $149.99 on release wasn’t it?

            Although even if they for some ridiculous reason created a version without the Kinect. I would only see them lowering the price to either $349.99 or $399.99.

            However honestly without the Kinect the console is completely useless. It’s completely built around the usage of the Kinect Senser. Otherwise it’s basically a slightly upgraded Xbox 360 Console. What’s even the point in moving to Xbox One if you want the exact same console.

            My only request is that you can use your console even if the Kinect Senser is not plugged in, but I more than agree as to why it should be included in the bundle. People may feel stubborn about it now, but when they realize how useful it is they will change their minds.

            It also helps developers since they will know that all consoles have a Kinect Sensor available.

          • Mike Glynn

            We’ll said

        • 360_Assassin

          have you seen the pictures from the people that hack web cams ? Hackers are SMART, if they want, they can hack Kinect on X1 because of how it’s designed to be always on.
          come on, just because MS says it’s safe, u really believe them? unless they put in writing that the camera can not be hacked, then no, Kinect is not ok to be mandatory

          • ZEISMAN

            Oh come on, you paranoid people.. What about your always on smartphones, laptop webcams, etc. It’s harder to break into the Xbox Live infrastructure and then to get to yout Xbox and Kinect. Man. All this bla bla is so ridicolous.

          • No Forced Kinect

            stfu dude, stop trollin an telling people to buy a ps4.

          • ZEISMAN

            If people have no arguments, they start swearing. Well done Mr. No Forced Kinect. Ridicolous.

          • 10 Year Vet

            actually a lot of people get fed up with trolls like you an just wish to tell you to F*** off so u get the point, stop telling everyone who has been with xbox for several years to get a ps4 , u dumba$$

          • Shane Nokes

            The system does hardware and software integrity checks against a known good signature. If the console is modified you won’t have to wonder if that’s the case. You’ll know it.

          • Jeremy Trifilo

            I am curious as to how someone would be able to perform that? It’s the same as saying someone can hack into my Wired Xbox Controller…

            I haven’t found anything to show the new Kinect gives off some sort of connection to the Xbox One other than the Original Kinect Sensor has the following: “the device makes use of a proprietary connector combining USB communication with additional power”.

            I do agree that it should not be mandatory though as there are no reasons for it to be.

        • Nun Ja

          If M$ doesn’t want to spy on us, then why is the kinect mandatory? Name one feature that is pro-consumer, can’t be achieved with the controller or is better with the kinect than the controller. We tell M$ what we don’t want because they need to know why we’re not going to buy the Xbox 180.

    • Audioslave

      To me, the problem with Kinect is the price. Because of it, the X1 will be more expensive than the PS4. It’s not a good idea especially at launch.
      Maybe they could advertise on Kinect but then, they really need to give a great Kinect game with the X1 and say look, you will have Kinect and this great game…If it’s just + $100 and no game, it won’t be attractive.

    • B00ME

      That wouldn’t go over well with the achievement hunters, they don’t like Kinect either.

      • No Forced Kinect

        there are TONS of people who don’t like Kinect, but that was one idea i think that might work. i don’t like kinect either, but being able to unplug it would be nice. and if they sold it with every x1 but it was NOT mandatory, then it would make a lot of people happy.

        • Nun Ja

          I don’t like the mark-up cost for something I refuse to use :/ spying aside, I would not use the kinect if I had one.

      • 10 Year Vet

        i’m an achievement hunter, my score is 164,000 an this would work for me. if i could plug kinect in when i wanted an it was not forced to be plugged in all the time, i wouldn’t mind doing this, in fact it would make me want to use kinect more. but having the choice of doing it and not doing it, that is what sounds nice to me. I don’t like being forced to use Kinect in games that I give two SH*ts about. Let me choose if I want to use it or not

        not every game needs Kinect just because the damn thing is plugged in to make the x1 even work.

        we need a choice as gamers.
        let it come with x1 but make it an option to use when we want, not manadtory

        • Gary Leadbeater

          just want to point out that the kinect is only mandatory for the xbox one to work you do NOT have to use it for your games or dashboard i repeat you do NOT have to use it if you dont want to.

          • Nun Ja

            It does have to be plugged in thought, obviously for non-nefarious purposes.

      • 10 Year Vet

        but if everyone has kinect all ready, but NOT mandatory, why not use kinect ofr the achivs and then unplug it when your done? i’m a achiv hunter too but if MS wants everyone to have the kinect, then send the kinect with every x1 just DO NOT make it mandatory

        • http://soundcloud.com/ViRUSfromMARS Jaffa Cake King

          Because i don’t want to have to use Kinect to unlock achievements. After supporting MS for over 10 years I don’t want to be forced to use a gimmicky peripheral just so i can fully complete my games.

          What about people who are physically incapable of using Kinect?

    • roozbeh

      My thoughts exactly

    • http://soundcloud.com/ViRUSfromMARS Jaffa Cake King

      Kinect based achievements? No thanks.

      I wouldn’t buy a game with Kinect based achievements or smartglass for that matter.

  • Carnage Rules

    The Xbox One has turned into a pathetic joke!!!! Thanks for bending over MS

    • Disturbed_Court_Jester

      Better them than us. =]

    • avi

      oh gtfo.

  • RED360

    DRM is a restriction not a feature.

    • Mike Glynn

      It does restrict but offers some excellent extras so it is a feature.

      • Rick

        Have yet to see anything good come out of “DRM” or “Restrictions” on things I buy.

        tell you what, go buy a car. the “DRM restriction” is you cant drive it more then half an hour every day. so if you get stuck in traffic, you must pull over and walk to work.

        Disobey and you will be jailed an fined in the millions of dollars.

        • DrToker

          What a stupid analogy, put I’ll play. DRM on the car would allow your wife to take the car to work and then you could download it and drive to your workplace. Dropped your car keys? No problem, just internet share with your phone and the car recognizes you, unlocks the doors and starts up. You can share your car instantly with up to ten people in the world (one at a time of course) and if you lose it or if it breaks you can download a new car.

          • Rick

            I currently can unlock my car with my phone WITHOUT your DRM… Now if i can just get it to do a little more.

    • DrToker

      DRM was necessary if you wanted the types of features MS offered.

      • Fitzgerald

        what do you think requiring the disc to be in the drive is? Yep, DRM. DRM is fine, it’s not evil, but it’s implementation often is, eroding consumer rights. The “features” MS offered were better than some implementations of DRM (like itunes) but still a step towards the erosion of consumer rights, which we should not tolerate.

  • Wade Holmes

    Hi, i dont know if anyone will read this, but i have been thinking over the last couple of days, and Microsoft, why not do both!!?. When you originally get your disk you can do all the stuff that the 360 does now…but if you CHOOSE TO KEEP the disk, you enter a code in the case, or scan the disk using the kinect, and its yours to do all the family sharing stuff. Even as more of an incentive to keep it, you could get some credit in your account to spend on whatever avatar, theme, or DLC you want. That way you wouldnt have to change your DRM too drastically. Seems simple to me, and your building that bridge from physical, to digital.

    • Steelahlive

      I think a lot of us think and feel the same way you do that they should’ve not been a drastic policy change but they appearance is that they couldn’t do one without the other so who knows we think they could because we think its software they say they can’t

    • Does Not Equal

      You are commenter #459 to suggest this idea (or some variant thereof).

    • Wisman Yen

      If no mechanisms provided to consumers to check the status of the license, this will have big problems in the case which consumers trade used games not via retailers but by themselves.

    • Xboner2013

      Because they had no intention for providing the family share as stated, if they did, like you said, it would still be an option.

      1.) Insert disc
      2.) Game boots from disc
      3.) Game asks you do you want to install to the game library or only use off line
      4.) If you want as part of game library than put in code while onine
      5.) If not, you do not have to put in code and you start playing or install to HDD where you always need the physical disc
      6.) Or just download the game, it’s automatically part of the game library… of course it should be 15-25% cheaper because there is no physical production cost or retailer.

      Of course, there is a reason why they did not provide details of the family share plan.

      • Shane Nokes

        They did detail quite a bit of it. In fact even Kotaku admits that they didn’t post everything they knew about it initially and even removed portions of their interview with Phil Spencer about it. This is all before the changes happened…so it satisfies your fetish for it being before the DRM removal.

        kotaku (dot) com/rumor-about-xbox-one-family-sharings-downsides-has-fla-534484570

        Halfway down the page they have the expanded transcript. They talk about the 2 member concurrent user limit and the fact that it doesn’t have to be an actual blood relative that you share with.

        Other MS exec’s like Yusuf Medhi said it could be someone thousands of miles away using their own console…before the DRM changes.

        No one ever talked about it being time-limited. The only person who ever did was someone who put up an anonymous pastebin. That pastebin has been debunked by myself, Aaron Greenberg, and Marc Whitten.

        Your refusal to believe in the details just shows either an abject unwillingness to participate in reality, or that you want to troll for reasons unknown.

        • Xboner2013

          Sorry no details…. before, during or after E3, this is a fact… no details on how it work, no demo, no screen shoots, no cost or fees… no nothing.

          Sorry, there is zero proof, zero evidence.

          If you were correct, then we will see those “features” at launch, since they will not release details… I wouldn’t count on that.

        • Sledg

          Just ignore Xboner2013! He doesn’t want to bother with facts and believes everything he reads on the internet. He’s a troll!

          • Xboner2013

            Please present the facts. No facts were given, all that was said was there is facts but they are secret… which means there is no facts and no evidence.

            MS might as well promised everyone a big pot of gold. If I am wrong, then MS can release these so called family share details today and we can then look forward to it at launch.

            I wouldn’t hold my breath. Good luck.

          • Shane Nokes

            Indeed. I’ve been probing now and then to see if that was the case for sure…and you are indeed correct.

  • robmc

    So I guess SONY’S rootkit fiasco will not allow you to purchase the PS4? Quote ” these people need to know that us adults don’t forgive and forget so easily. ”

    Or how about SONY removing the “other” OS with a update after launch ?

    Or how about SONY removing backwards compatibility after the second PS3 update? Remember now what you said ?

    these people need to know that us adults don’t forgive and forget so easily.
    I agree

    • robmc

      From your beloved SONY Quote “US senior VP Steve Heckler foreshadowed the events of late. Heckler told attendees at the Americas Conference on Information Systems “The industry will take whatever steps it needs to protect itself and protect its revenue streams… It will not lose that revenue stream, no matter what… Sony is going to take aggressive steps to stop this. We will develop technology that transcends the individual user. We will firewall Napster at source – we will block it at your cable company. We will block it at your phone company. We will block it at your ISP. We will firewall it at your PC… These strategies are being aggressively pursued because there is simply too much at stake.

 
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